Crown Prince of Saudi Arabia Rejects Most Hadiths

Wake up Pak

Prime Minister (20k+ posts)
Quran says pray but it’s not written how to pray, Quran says perform hajj but it’s not mentioned how?? We have to obey Quran and Hadith both, denial of one is not possible.
Same typical questions but no one have the answers.
Have you read the Quran? Can you show me the way to perform namaz from the Quran as the Quran is detailed and complete?
How about hadeeth? Can you show me on complete hadeeth which gives you detail of namaz from the beginning till the end?
 

akinternational

Minister (2k+ posts)
Agar video asli bhi hai to koi ahmiyyat nahin rakhti.... kisi hadith ke sahih hone ka faisla marica ka ghulam nahin kar sakta... han mulk me jo chahe qanun mausallat kar de... Pakistan men to quran sood ko haram kehta hai lekin soodi qanun musallat hai.... munafiq hukumat, Sadr, wazir e azam ya governer state bank?????
 

Keep the trust

Minister (2k+ posts)
Same typical questions but no one have the answers.
Have you read the Quran? Can you show me the way to perform namaz from the Quran as the Quran is detailed and complete?
How about hadeeth? Can you show me on complete hadeeth which gives you detail of namaz from the beginning till the end?


Book 4, Number 0759:
Ibn Umar reported that the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him), when he stood up for prayer, used to raise his hands apposite the shoulders and then recited takbir (Allah-o-Akbar), and when he was about to bow he again did like it and when he raised himself from the ruku' (bowing posture) he again did like it, but he did not do it at the time of raising his head from prostration.

“AND WE HAVE SENT DOWN THEE THE MESSAGE: THAT THOU MAYEST EXPLAIN CLEARLY TO MEN WHAT IS SENT FOR THEM”.
The Holy Quran itself commands that the Prophet’s (PBUH) teachings have to be obeyed. Whenever Quran commands its followers to obey Allah, it also commands them to obey Prophet (PBUH). It declares that obedience to Prophet (PBUH) is obedience to Allah himself. The Quran says:

“HE WHO OBEYS THE MESSENGER, OBEYS ALLAH”
At another instance, Quran says:

“OBEY ALLAH AND OBEY THE MESSENGER”
The Hadith of Prophet (PBUH) along with Quran is the foundation of Quranic laws.
While the Quran gives Muslims a primary rule of life, there are many matters where guidance for practical life is necessary. In cases where Quran is silent, Hadith has to be followed. There could be no better guide than Prophet (PBUH) himself, who provided an oral and practical interpretation and commentary as an aid to the correct understanding of the meaning of Quran. The structure of Shariah is thus based on Quran and the words and actions of Prophet (PBUH).
It seems you read Quran but unfortunately failed to understand.
 

Wake up Pak

Prime Minister (20k+ posts)
Good, Slowly but surely the Muslims are reverting to the Quran alone.

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See these morons, ☝️ ☝️ ☝️ ☝️ I mean, who in their right mind will dislike the post if the Muslims are reverting back to the Quran alone? This shows how much illiterate and ignorant are these so-called Muslims. Allah Hidayat daay.
 

Wake up Pak

Prime Minister (20k+ posts)

Book 4, Number 0759:



The Holy Quran itself commands that the Prophet’s (PBUH) teachings have to be obeyed. Whenever Quran commands its followers to obey Allah, it also commands them to obey Prophet (PBUH). It declares that obedience to Prophet (PBUH) is obedience to Allah himself. The Quran says:


At another instance, Quran says:


The Hadith of Prophet (PBUH) along with Quran is the foundation of Quranic laws.
While the Quran gives Muslims a primary rule of life, there are many matters where guidance for practical life is necessary. In cases where Quran is silent, Hadith has to be followed. There could be no better guide than Prophet (PBUH) himself, who provided an oral and practical interpretation and commentary as an aid to the correct understanding of the meaning of Quran. The structure of Shariah is thus based on Quran and the words and actions of Prophet (PBUH).
It seems you read Quran but unfortunately failed to understand.
You wrote: At another instance, Quran says:

The Hadith of Prophet (PBUH) along with Quran is the foundation of Quranic laws.

Can you please give me the ayat where it says it?
Okay, even if I accept your argument which in fact I don't, can you show me how to pray from hadeeth?
 

Wake up Pak

Prime Minister (20k+ posts)

Book 4, Number 0759:



The Holy Quran itself commands that the Prophet’s (PBUH) teachings have to be obeyed. Whenever Quran commands its followers to obey Allah, it also commands them to obey Prophet (PBUH). It declares that obedience to Prophet (PBUH) is obedience to Allah himself. The Quran says:


At another instance, Quran says:


The Hadith of Prophet (PBUH) along with Quran is the foundation of Quranic laws.
While the Quran gives Muslims a primary rule of life, there are many matters where guidance for practical life is necessary. In cases where Quran is silent, Hadith has to be followed. There could be no better guide than Prophet (PBUH) himself, who provided an oral and practical interpretation and commentary as an aid to the correct understanding of the meaning of Quran. The structure of Shariah is thus based on Quran and the words and actions of Prophet (PBUH).
It seems you read Quran but unfortunately failed to understand.
When we tell people that 'we believe the Quran alone is all we need'

They will respond by claiming we have denied the sunna of the messenger because God says "obey God and the messenger" in the Quran

And they claim that 'obey God' refers to the Quran, and 'obey the messenger' with the books of Hadith and Sunna

So they believe 'obey God and the messenger' is to follow two different sources.

So let's study the phrase 'obey God and the messenger' from a Quranic point of view

The first Observation: The Quran always says 'obey God and the messenger'.

Never does it say 'obey the prophet' or 'obey Muhammad'.

It is always 'obey God and the messenger'
So it is important to understand what the term 'messenger' (Rasool) means.


And why God did not say 'obey the prophet (nabi)'?

Muhammad had two status: The status of NUBUWA (prophethood) And the status of RASOOL (messenger)

The status of NUBUWA - the word NUBUWA means 'high or elevated place'.

This means that God has chosen Muhammad, out of all the humans, to communicate with him certain news, prophecies, etc.

So the status of NUBUWA (prophet) means that a human being is communicating with God.

The status of RASOOL - God tells us the status of RASOOL in the Quran:

(5:67) O messenger, deliver what was sent down to you from your Lord. And if you do not, then you have not delivered His message...

We see that God clearly tells us the duty of the messenger is to deliver the message of God

God also says: (24:54) ...there is nothing upon the messenger except the clear delivery...

This teaches us that the sole duty of the messenger is to deliver the message to the people

So if God did not give Muhammad the 'message', then he would not be called 'messenger' (Rasool).

So God calls him 'Rasool because Muhammad is carrying the 'message'.

What is this message that Muhammad carried? The answers for this in the Quran:
(6:19) ...this Quran has been inspired me to deliver it to you and whoever it reaches...


All these verses teach us that the duty of a messenger is to deliver the message.

Muhammad - the messenger - is required to send us the Quran

So when God says "obey the messenger" we are essentially obeying the 'message' itself

Another observation: God says in the Quran (4:80) "Whoever obeys the messenger, has obeyed God..."

This means when we obey the messenger - the message - the Quran, we have in reality obeyed God

All these verses teach us that 'obey God and the messenger' is essentially obeying ONE source - the Quran

Let's assume that the Quran tells us "obey God" without mentioning obeying the messenger. How would we do that?

This would mean that God Himself would have to come to earth and give us the Quran directly

This of course is illogical

This is why we are to 'obey God and the messenger' - because God gave Muhammad 'the message' which makes him 'a messenger'

And the messenger is required to deliver it to humanity.

So this is what 'obey God and the messenger' means from the Quran.

"Obey God and the messenger" is essentially ONE source - the Quran.

We obey the messenger because he has the 'the message'.
 

ingenious

New Member
You wrote: At another instance, Quran says:

The Hadith of Prophet (PBUH) along with Quran is the foundation of Quranic laws.

Can you please give me the ayat where it says it?
Okay, even if I accept your argument which in fact I don't, can you show me how to pray from hadeeth?
Kindly guide me how to perform salat from Quran only?
 

Mughal1

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
Word of God and word of man both are vitally important in their own ways for humanity to live properly in this world. Confusion is result of not knowing the solid criterion for either or both of them.

The quran serves a different purpose and human history serves a different purpose. The quran is word of God which needs to be understood properly in its own proper context but the question is how to make proper sense of the quran? For this we need a solid criterion and we have that solid criterion but do we know what it is? Most of us do not till they are told about it. For that we need to rely upon direct and indirect learning methods. Direct learning method is entirely based upon our own personal life experiences and nothing more. So this is first clear cut proof that to understand the quran we need help of direct human life experiences. None can dispute this.

However we get stuck when we see that we cannot experience each and everything directly by ourselves or personally. This is where in comes indirect learning method. This means we humans depends upon learning from each other's life experiences. You teach me something from your direct life experiences and I tell you something from mine and that is how by scratching each other's backs we expand our storage of information and we learn sense from all that.

Revelation of God is also a direct experience but only of a very few people whom we call messengers of God. For the rest of human beings it is only an indirect method of learning that information and then we try our best to make proper sense of it any way we can. The biggest thing we owe to humanity is its invention of human language without which we will be totally at a loss.

So one can see how much humanity depends upon each other for knowing anything and everything in this world. This is why we cannot dismiss any of it and he who dismisses human works in actual fact dismisses God's works as well. Now if a human being dismisses works of God and man then what is one left with? With absolutely nothing at all.

However human works are full of problems and none can dispute that. This is why a solid criterion is absolutely necessary to try to get to the truth as far as it is humanly possible for us human beings. That is what humanity needs to work at to sift through all kinds of falsehood and nonsense to reach the actual or real truth.

This is why none can reject hadith works or fiqh works because they are history works about muslims by muslims of various time periods. They can provide us with solid precedents. But we must pick and choose things because all is not perfect in human works. For example, our historians have included in their works some miraculous, magical, superstitious and even fictitious stuff as well. Not only that much of information is interpreted out of its proper context which makes it confusing and meaningless.

This is why there is a most pressing need for us muslims to create scholars who could sort out all this messed up stuff for us. We do not need foolish mullaans who try to force down our throats wrong stuff that in no way is acceptable because it is anti quran and anti humanity. For example, mullaans tell us islam is merely a religion like all other religions which it is not. Mullaans have turned us into cultists who worship personalities.

In actual fact islam is a deen ie it is a proper way of life for humanity to live by from God. Why God advised this way of life for humanity? Because he has created humanity for serving his purpose and unless people accept that purpose for their life and get on with its fulfilment that purpose cannot be fulfilled. So people better do what is needed to be done and stop running about here there everywhere like headless chickens. For better understanding of deen of islam from the quran see HERE, HERE, HERE and HERE.
 
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Pakistani1947

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
Quran says pray but it’s not written how to pray, Quran says perform hajj but it’s not mentioned how?? We have to obey Quran and Hadith both, denial of one is not possible.
Agar video asli bhi hai to koi ahmiyyat nahin rakhti.... kisi hadith ke sahih hone ka faisla marica ka ghulam nahin kar sakta... han mulk me jo chahe qanun mausallat kar de... Pakistan men to quran sood ko haram kehta hai lekin soodi qanun musallat hai.... munafiq hukumat, Sadr, wazir e azam ya governer state bank?????

Good, Slowly but surely the Muslims are reverting to the Quran alone.
قرآن اللہ تعالیٰ کا کلام ہے اور ہر مسلمان کو بلا شبہ اس کی ہر آیت پر ایمان لانا چاہئے۔ جبکہ احادیث انسانوں نے مرتب کی ہیں، اور انسانی غلطیوں اور کمزوریوں کے تابع ہیں۔ محدثین نے تصنیف حدیث کے ابتدائی مرحلے میں بہت عمدہ کام کیا ہے۔ ایسا لگتا ہے کہ ان کی توجہ مختلف سلسلہ وار روایات اور مصدقہ راویوں کے ذریعہ حدیث کی توثیق کرنے کی کوشش رہی تھی (اور وہ زیادہ تر معاملات میں ایسا کرنے میں کامیاب ہوگئے تھے) لیکن بعض احادیث کے معاملے میں قرآن مجید کی روح کے ساتھ حدیث کے متن کی توثیق نہ کر پاۓ ۔ الحمدللہ ، ایسی احادیث انتہائی کم ہیں جو مستند تو قرار دی گئیں باوجود اسکہ وہ قرآن کے متن / روح کے مطابقت نہیں رکھتی ہیں۔ ذیل میں حدیث پر مبنی اسلام ویب ڈاٹ نیٹ پر ایک مفتی کے ذریعہ دیئے گئے فتوے کی ایک عمدہ مثال دی گئی ہے ، جو قرآنی متن سے مطابقت نہیں رکھتی ۔


Source: https://www.islamweb.net/emainpage/PrintFatwa.php?lang=E&Id=337408

نیچے قرآن کی وہ آیات پیش کی جا رہی ہیں جس سے واضح ہوتا ہے کہ اللہ ان لوگوں کی توبہ قبول نہیں کرتا جو برے کام کرتےرہتے ہیں یہاں تک کہ جب موت کا وقت آ جاتا ہے اس وقت کہتا ہے کہ اب میں توبہ کرتا ہوں:۔

Qur'an 4:18 وَلَيْسَتِ التَّوْبَةُ لِلَّذِينَ يَعْمَلُونَ السَّيِّئَاتِ حَتَّىٰ إِذَا حَضَرَ أَحَدَهُمُ الْمَوْتُ قَالَ إِنِّي تُبْتُ الْآنَ وَلَا الَّذِينَ يَمُوتُونَ وَهُمْ كُفَّارٌ ۚ أُولَـٰئِكَ أَعْتَدْنَا لَهُمْ عَذَابًا أَلِيمًا
اور ان لوگوں کی توبہ قبول نہیں ہے جو برے کام کرتےرہتے ہیں یہاں تک کہ جب ان میں سے کسی کی موت کا وقت آ جاتا ہے اس وقت کہتا ہے کہ اب میں توبہ کرتا ہوں اوراسی طرح ان لوگو ں کی توبہ قبول نہیں ہے جو کفر کی حالت میں مرتے ہیں ان کے لیے ہم نے دردناک عذاب تیار کیا ہے

Qur'an 10:90 وَجَاوَزْنَا بِبَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ الْبَحْرَ فَأَتْبَعَهُمْ فِرْعَوْنُ وَجُنُودُهُ بَغْيًا وَعَدْوًا ۖ حَتَّىٰ إِذَا أَدْرَكَهُ الْغَرَقُ قَالَ آمَنتُ أَنَّهُ لَا إِلَـٰهَ إِلَّا الَّذِي آمَنَتْ بِهِ بَنُو إِسْرَائِيلَ وَأَنَا مِنَ الْمُسْلِمِينَ
اور ہم نے بنی اسرائیل کو دریا سے پار کر دیا پھر فرعون اور اس کے لشکر نے ظلم اور زيادتی سے ان کا پیچھا کیا یہاں تک کہ جب ڈوبنےلگا کہا میں ایمان لایا کہ کوئی معبود نہیں مگر جس پر بنی اسرائیل ایمان لائے ہیں اور میں فرمانبردار میں سے ہوں

Qur'an 10:91 آلْآنَ وَقَدْ عَصَيْتَ قَبْلُ وَكُنتَ مِنَ الْمُفْسِدِينَ
اب یہ کہتا ہے اورتو اس سے پہلے نافرمانی کرتا رہا اور مفسدوں میں داخل رہا

اگر محدثین نے اس حدیث کو اپنی کتاب کا حصہ بنانے سے پہلے اس روایت کا قرآن کے متن سے موازنہ کیا ہوتا تو شاید وہ اس روایت کو حدیث کی کتاب میں شامل نہ کرتے۔ اس بات کا ہرگز یہ مطلب نہ لیا جاۓ کا محدثین قابل اعتبار نہیں بلکہ ان سے نا دانستگی میں بوجہ انسانی کمزوری کچھ غلطیاں ہو گئیں۔ ان غلطیوں کے باوجود صحاح ستہ کی چھ کتابیں، بخاری ،مسلم، ترمزی، ابو داؤد، نسائی اور ابن ماجہ حدیث کی مستند ترین کتابیں ہیں، ضرورت اس امر کی ہے کہ احادیث کے اس ذخیرے سے کوئی حدیث لیتے وقت یہ اطمنان کر لینا چاہیے کہ وہ کسی طور پر قرآن سے متصادم تو نہیں ہیں۔

والله أعلم
 
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akinternational

Minister (2k+ posts)
Agar video asli bhi hai to koi ahmiyyat nahin rakhti.... kisi hadith ke sahih hone ka faisla marica ka ghulam nahin kar sakta... han mulk me jo chahe qanun mausallat kar de... Pakistan men to quran sood ko haram kehta hai lekin soodi qanun musallat hai.... munafiq hukumat, Sadr, wazir e azam ya governer state bank?????
muazrat ke apke jazbat ko thes ponhchi....kya bura lag gaya janab e aali????? quran ka hukm ke ssod haram hai, ya soodi qanun lagu karne wale????? wazahat farma den to banda shukrguzar hoga...
 

Citizen X

President (40k+ posts)
ان غلطیوں کے باوجود صحاح ستہ کی چھ کتابیں، بخاری ،مسلم، ترمزی، ابو داؤد، نسائی اور ابن ماجہ حدیث کی مستند ترین کتابیں ہیں، ضرورت اس امر کی ہے کہ احادیث کے اس ذخیرے سے کوئی حدیث لیتے وقت یہ اطمنان کر لینا چاہیے کہ وہ کسی طور پر قرآن سے متصادم تو نہیں ہیں۔

والله أعلم
You only say that because you've been told to believe so

Great well know famous People who were alive less than a 100 years ago we don't have complete details of their lives in an age where record keeping is a norm, voice can be recorded, still and moving images can be captured and still very hard to authenticate facts. And now when science has proven human memory is not very reliable how is one to trust things passed down verbally 100s of years later.

The simple fact is there is no hukum or religious edict in the hadith, nor should we take any because of its highly unreliable nature. People who wrote down the hadith even simple details of their own lives are sketchy at best then how can you base your religion on their writings.

I'll give you a simple example, do we have every detail of lets say Muhammad Ali Jinnah, Allama Iqbal or even Hitler. To this day we don't know for sure if Hitler really committed suicide or escaped.

Nobody is asking you to become a kafir or do any ghustakhi, I say this because the first thought which comes into peoples mind. Just asking you to think logically thats all.