I am of the view that we human beings are still not knowledgeable enough to talk about God, his revelation and creation properly. I think so because I see people lack knowledge about some very basic things involved in this regard. Can anyone explain to oneself how many stages of learning there are for a human being to be able to talk about God related things in a sensible way with others? The point made here is that if one cannot explain something to oneself properly then one cannot explain it properly to others either. Therefore anyone who is interested in talking about God, his creation and revelation with others first must learn things oneself.
I think we humans need to go through three stages of learning before we could talk about God in a sensible way. Our first stage of learning is all about things we can detect directly with our senses after our birth. All we need to do is observe what things are and what they do and how they do what they do or why they do what they do. This is how we start rationalising things or this is how we start developing our logical thinking about things from the most simple to the most complex. If we do not learn things to this stage we cannot move on to the next stage. The better we are at reasoning the better is our understanding or comprehension of things. In the beginning we can only perform most simple tasks but as we get busy with our learning in time we come to the stage whereby we can perform most complex tasks. Compare mechanism involved in a bike to the mechanisms involved in a car or an aeroplane etc. If we do not understand bike mechanism then we surely cannot understand aeroplane mechanisms. Moreover if we do not understand visible mechanisms then we cannot understand invisible mechanisms because for that we need to develop higher level of thinking ability.
Once we have reach first stage of thinking level then comes our second stage of learning which is about things that are not all directly reachable by our senses. Now we try our best to come up with tools or instruments whereby we extend our power of observations or detection. By this stage of knowledge we come to realise the fact that not all that exists is detectable by our senses directly. Here we start calling things visible as well as invisible or detectable as well as undetectable. In other words we come to know by this stage that some things are accessible by us and others not. Now stage one of our learning comes to our help if had trained ourselves well in logical thinking. In case of first stage if one was using a bike for riding and it broke, it will only need a visible inspection to find fault in it eg if a person was riding a bike and was going along then suddenly the turning of pedals became ineffective then one will try to look at the bike to see what may have gone wrong. As the rider inspects the bike he sees the chain has broken down, one was able to find this fault very easily for two main reasons a)the mechanism was simple and b)the whole mechanism was visible directly. Had it been a tv set which had broken down then the fault finding process will not be that simple. It is because the tv set will have much more complex circuitry and will be involving many more components as well as some totally invisible things as well. So now we will have to be able to reason things out at a much higher level to figure out the fault. We will have to know functions of components and the involved circuitry as to how exactly these components etc make a tv set work the way it works so what could cause the fault that has developed in the tv set. Once we have reached this stage of learning then we need to go to yet higher stage of learning when we have to deal with things that are totally undetectable with our senses or even with any tool or instrument.
Unless one has reached stage one of thinking level one cannot go to stage two of learning and likewise if one has not mastered stage two of thinking level then one cannot go for stage three of thinking level. Stage one is about directly detectable or sensible things but stage two involves some detectable as well as some undetectable things. Stage three however involves things that are not detectable at all by us directly but there effects or affects are made obvious to us through explanations alone. No explanation is a visible object because it is only and only our mental process. This is why to know whether there is a God or not or that the quran is a book from God or not we need to be able to reason things out at stage three level. Unless one is really good at this, one cannot know the truth with needed reasonable certainty.
This is why I am trying to explain things the way I understand them. During my study of the quran I realised that there are some aspects, implications of which we human beings have not yet realised for proper understanding of the quran. We have been side tracked by each other instead of taking aboard some very basic but vitally important points. This is the reason I started this thread the way I did. It is because we need to be clear about some things before we actually discuss the quran.
Atheism is having a go at the religion which I see as a good thing because it brings theists out of their depth and helps to drag them towards rationality so that they could become rational thinkers and give up the nonsense called religion. I myself am anti religion because it is very damaging for humanity in various ways. It does not bring people to God but leads them away from God into utter confusion and perplexity or puzzlement. Religion in my view is therefore a most dangerous thing for humanity, in fact more dangerous than atheism. It is because religion keeps people foolish or worse stupid or ignorant and illiterate. This I hope will become clear as we develop this discussion and I explain more and more things.
My other point is against atheism ie to me God of the gaps is more appealing and better way to tackle this issue than no God approach till we come across God. Why? Because no God approach is also very dangerous for humanity to take as it has most serious consequences for humanity as we have been experiencing directly or indirectly all along throughout our lives ie Godless human society is a dangerous society by its very nature in my view based upon our life experiences. This is why to me there is a God unless we can prove otherwise. Why?
It is because our main question to ourselves is, how did all that exists come about? Was it always there or was it brought into existence by a creator? In this regard a question arises, could non-existing things come about out of absolute nothingness? Or could zero ever equal one and vice versa? My answer is never. I mean nothing can come into existence out of absolute nothingness. This means either there is a creator or that all that exists is ever existing. Now ever existence of anything has its own implications eg whatever is ever existing remains the way it is and it cannot change in its nature because a thing can only change in its nature if some other outside force acts upon it. Since there is no other force there to begin with then ever existing thing cannot change in its nature therefore it must remain as it is or as it ever was. Anything that changes during its existence cannot be called ever existing. For example, if we call a chicken ever existing then the chicken must remain a chicken throughout its period of existence. If the chicken becomes a cow or sheep or goat etc etc during its time of existence then it cannot be called an ever existing chicken. So if God is called ever existing then that means God has to remain as he is always. He cannot be a God one minute and the next minute a human being. This is why anything that changes its nature cannot be God nor ever existing.
Since whatever exists before our eyes is always changing with time that means someone is causing it to change otherwise it could not change. This means whatever exists and is changing is not ever existing rather it was created by one who does not change. This means the universe was created by a God.
Scientists say the creator has to be something simple so God is far too complex a being to be considered as a creator. I disagree. In my view the very existence of something simple is impossible. Why? Because to be simple and be ever existing both contradict each other. After all what did not exist could never come into existence. If something is ever existing then ever existence is not a simple thing. Moreover even for argument sake if we accept there is such a thing as simple then it will remain as it was forever. So it could not create the creation. To create the kind of creation we observe, it had to be at least as complex as the creation it has created by implication. Therefore It ought to be knowledgeable and it ought to be able choose and decide things etc etc. So the idea that God is far too complex being for start of creation is proven completely wrong.
This means we have a God and we have his creation because otherwise nothing could exist to begin with. So those who claim there is no God and all that exists came into being all by itself seem to be totally wrong. They have no basis to stand upon.
My next problem is with people who say there is no scientific knowledge in the quran. This in my view is result of their lack of awareness or realisation of the fact that people do not have knowledge of the future ie people cannot know future till it comes to pass. In other words we human beings cannot know things we must come to know till our time has come for knowing those things.
Let me try and explain this issue by way of an example. Let us suppose we have a newly born baby and all his relatives have phds in various fields of knowledge. Can they teach all that they know to that new born baby at once? No, they cannot no matter how hard they try. Why not? It is because we humans are created by God to grow or evolve with time both psychologically as well as biologically so we cannot learn anything at all till our time has come to learn it. So people even to memorise a message need ample time let alone its proper understanding. People are born knowing absolutely nothing. They need to start learning things by direct experience of things and this is where science starts from because without direct interactions with things we could not learn or know anything at all in our lives. It is because as I explained already our brains can only understand things by way of explanations of things alone. In other words explanations arise in our minds by thinking or reasoning after observation of things. The question is what are we doing when we say we are reasoning? We try to connect dots in our minds about things we are thinking about. As explained already by me we learn how to make links or connections between things just as we learned right from the very start by looking at nature as to how things are interconnected or interlinked.
This is how we use a mental process called deductive reasoning. This is why my first point is very important for people to try and understand. This is why people who have not yet learned to be rational at the very basic level they cannot understand the quran either because the quran is a book for people who have reached the highest stage or level of understanding things rationally. It is because people who have translated and interpreted the quran they have not reached that level therefore they have turned the message in the quran into a nonsense in their translations or interpretations.
This is why in my view we cannot have any proper interpretation of the quran till we reach the level of knowledge that is required for interpreting the quran properly. The quran talks about all things essential for knowledge of humanity for bringing about a proper human community in the kingdom of God. They cannot do so till they learn the quran as it ought to be learned. A scripture from God had to be such that was sensible or rational so irrational people till they become rationally solid could never interpret it correctly. One has to think about how many people we have in this world who have attained to three levels of understanding things I have explained. In this world as far as I see it, a lot of people are ignorant, illiterate, uneducated, untrained or unskilled or inexperienced in thinking or reasoning things properly so they are superstitious who believe anything and everything without being able to reason things out properly. In short they have not learned the sense of making proper sense of things.
Besides being able to put two and two together we humans have a huge problem with human language. Very few of us have ability to know and use our mother tongue as effectively as it ought to be used. Our vocabularies are very limited this is why we cannot express ourselves to each other properly. We can see a dictionary has hundred thousand words but how many of them we can truly spell correctly or know their meanings or proper uses? Then how many of us know how human languages came about and developed? Why is this vitally important to know? It is because our use of language is very different from God's use of language. Why it is different? It is because God already knows all there is to know about any and everything that is going on but we humans don't. Why not? Because it takes time for us to discover or learn things as already explained. For example, when we use a word for naming something, we do not necessary know anything much about the thing we name but God does in all its detail. For example, we named a thing, human being, but what do we really know about this creature we call a human being? So far very little. Had God told us things about human beings, could we therefore understand them? No, I just gave example of a baby with phd relatives. We will still need time to grow and make sense of things by ourselves at our own pace of learning through direct interacting with things. So our level of knowledge is nowhere near level of knowledge of God. It can never be. Moreover God did not reveal his message to reinforce the nonsense we already have gathered in our heads but to teach us something very different because he had a purpose in his mind for creating us human beings and all the rest of things we see all around us or not see yet because they are hidden from us or are beyond our reach. This is why he revealed his message to tell us what his purpose was and what part in his scheme of things we need to play in order to fulfil that purpose. This is why he told us how to live or what to do and how to do it so that we could fulfil the purpose for which God has created us. This is why knowing the quran properly is absolutely necessary for us as it ought to be known but it cannot be known unless we come to know its related real world realities first. In other words we must first go through our learning stages as explained already before we the people could make any real sense of the quran.
Coming to human languages, in our human languages words have multiple meanings, the question is, how can we come to know what meaning is meant by God for a word when we try to understand or make sense of message of God? This is where in comes the idea of context. This is why the quran cannot be understood unless we first try to read it to discover its proper context. This is why anyone who criticises the text of the quran must first learn a lot of vitally important things before one could say anything and everything about the quran properly. Just knowing a particular language is not enough to interpret the quran, this is why even arabs are as confused as nonarabs when it comes to proper understanding of the quran. Arabs do not know how to understand the quran properly. Why not? Because they are as dumb about things I am talking about and going to talk about as any other people in the world. Just by reading a book we cannot understand things it talks about till we also learn properly about its related things and understand them, so that we could make sense of the book. That is where proper understanding comes from. You cannot be a good politician just by reading a book about politics or for that matter any other book about anything else eg economics or engineering or medicine or law or even a cooking book etc etc. Let me explain it by way of an example. Suppose you tell a baby, make me a cup of tea. What do you think the baby needs to know before he could make you a cup of tea? Can you see what I am getting at? Likewise if we do not learn about things we need to know for proper understanding of the quranic message then we cannot understand the quran properly. This is why people spend a good several years in learning some professions or trades. This is why to specialise in understanding of the quran properly one has to do vitally important needed homework.