PTI losing in Pervaiz Khattak's City, who claims he is all N all in KPK

[Awan S]

Btw dukh is baat ka tum jaise ghaddar modi k pillayyyy again Pakistan pay musalat hon gaye imran nlazi ki Wajah say

اگر ملک بہتر کی بجائے بدتر ہو رہا ہو اور اس حکومت پر تنقید کرنے والے مودی کے ایجنٹ ہیں ؟ کیا ملک بربادی کے لئے خان صاحب کو اسلئے صرف دے دیا جائے کہ آپ کو خان پسند ہے ؟ آپ کی آنا کی تسکین ہو ؟ میں چلینج کرتا ہوں ثابت کریں خان حکومت پچھلی حکومت سے بہتر ہے تو میں مان لونگا میں مودی کا ایجنٹ ہوں - ہمیں اپنا ملک عزیز ہے خان جائے لاکھوں آئے اور تاریخ میں گم ہو گئے

 

[Okara]

That was marshal law don't compare it with current time. I think you should read today's newspapers when in NA 75; votes of 23 constituencies were disappeared overnight by election commission staff. Is not dhandli bigger than using government machinery?

I know Musharraf was Military Dictator and Shoukat Aziz was his PM and can use the machinery to won election.
If you you give me one example where PPP lost a by-election in Sindh especially in interior Sindh will help us to decide if Sindh is under dictatorship or democracy?

 

[Okara]

جس نظام کی بنیاد ہی غلط ہو وہ کامیاب نہیں ہو سکتا - مارشل لاء لگانا غلط تھا تو ہر بار مارشل لاء میں اس ملک میں خون کی ندیاں بہیں - مشرف کے آخری مارشل لاء میں پچاس ہزار بے گناہ لوگ بمب دھماکوں کی نظر ہوئے - دو ہزار اٹھارہ کے الیکشن سے پہلے پولیٹیکل انجینیرنگ کی گئی تمام کرپٹ غنڈے بدمعاش جاگیردار کارخانہ داروں کو ایک پارٹی میں اکٹھا کیا گیا پھر دوسری پارٹی کے لوگوں بمحہ لیڈر جیل ڈالا گیا اور الیکشن آخر میں تین دن تک روک کر آخری سیٹیں اسی پارٹی کو دلائی گئیں پھر بھی نمبر پورے نہ ہوئے تو جہانگیر ترین کے جہاز میں بندے ڈھو کر نمبر پورے کئے - کیا ایسی نا انصافی سے کوئی خیر کی توقو ع کر سکتا ہے - عمران خان اور بزدار دونوں کو کوئی سمجھ نہیں ملک کیسے چلانا ہے اور باقی ان کے ساتھ کرپٹ مافیا ہے جو اقتدار انجونے کر رہا ہے نتیجہ سب کے سامنے ہے ملک پہلے سے کہیں زیادہ پیچھے جا چکا ہے - الله اس ملک کے لوگوں کی حالت پر رحم کرے -

Awan Sahib,
Who started Changa Manga and Bhorban Culture in Politics? Also what was the name of Politician who started Lifafa culture with journalists?

 

[Awan S]

Awan Sahib,
Who started Changa Manga and Bhorban Culture in Politics? Also what was the name of Politician who started Lifafa culture with journalists?

جی کسی ایک نے غلط کیا تو اس کا مطلب یہ نہیں سب اس کو فولو کریں اور کہیں غلطی اس کی ہے جس نے یہ شروع کیا - سارے سیاست دان گندے ہیں اور خان صاحب بھی انہیں کے رنگ میں رنگے گئے ہیں - نون لیگ کو واپس اقتدار میں آنا ہے تو خان صاحب کو اقتدار بچانا ہے - خان صاحب اپنا اقتدار بچانے کے لئے اپنے کرپٹ چھپا کر نون لیگ پر حملے کر رہے ہیں - خان صاحب کو خود کو ایک میچور سیاست دان اور کارکردگی دکھانے کا موقع ملا تھا مگر افسوس وہ اتنی بھی کارکردگی نہیں دکھا سکتے جتنی پچھلی حکومت نے دکھائی - بار بار پچھلی حکومت کو کرپٹ کہنے سے بات نہیں بنے گی کارکردگی دکھانی ہو گی اور یہ بات خان صاحب کو سمجھ نہیں آ رہی - تاریخ یہ مواقھے بار بار نہیں دے گی

 

[Awan S]

I know Musharraf was Military Dictator and Shoukat Aziz was his PM and can use the machinery to won election.
If you you give me one example where PPP lost a by-election in Sindh especially in interior Sindh will help us to decide if Sindh is under dictatorship or democracy?

If people vote PPP in Sindh we should not have any objection on it. People vote Khan sahib in KPK due to Khan factor but is fine. Every one has right to choose representative of their own choice. I don't think there is dictatorship in Sindh, people used their right and PPP comes into power through a democratic process. In Musharaf Marshal Law PPP lost election in Sindh that was dictatorship. The only solution of Pakistan's problems is to let the democracy run and make elections free and fair and then let the people decide whoever they want to choose.

 

[Okara]

جی کسی ایک نے غلط کیا تو اس کا مطلب یہ نہیں سب اس کو فولو کریں اور کہیں غلطی اس کی ہے جس نے یہ شروع کیا - سارے سیاست دان گندے ہیں اور خان صاحب بھی انہیں کے رنگ میں رنگے گئے ہیں - نون لیگ کو واپس اقتدار میں آنا ہے تو خان صاحب کو اقتدار بچانا ہے - خان صاحب اپنا اقتدار بچانے کے لئے اپنے کرپٹ چھپا کر نون لیگ پر حملے کر رہے ہیں - خان صاحب کو خود کو ایک میچور سیاست دان اور کارکردگی دکھانے کا موقع ملا تھا مگر افسوس وہ اتنی بھی کارکردگی نہیں دکھا سکتے جتنی پچھلی حکومت نے دکھائی - بار بار پچھلی حکومت کو کرپٹ کہنے سے بات نہیں بنے گی کارکردگی دکھانی ہو گی اور یہ بات خان صاحب کو سمجھ نہیں آ رہی - تاریخ یہ مواقھے بار بار نہیں دے گی

 

[Okara]

جی کسی ایک نے غلط کیا تو اس کا مطلب یہ نہیں سب اس کو فولو کریں اور کہیں غلطی اس کی ہے جس نے یہ شروع کیا - سارے سیاست دان گندے ہیں اور خان صاحب بھی انہیں کے رنگ میں رنگے گئے ہیں - نون لیگ کو واپس اقتدار میں آنا ہے تو خان صاحب کو اقتدار بچانا ہے - خان صاحب اپنا اقتدار بچانے کے لئے اپنے کرپٹ چھپا کر نون لیگ پر حملے کر رہے ہیں - خان صاحب کو خود کو ایک میچور سیاست دان اور کارکردگی دکھانے کا موقع ملا تھا مگر افسوس وہ اتنی بھی کارکردگی نہیں دکھا سکتے جتنی پچھلی حکومت نے دکھائی - بار بار پچھلی حکومت کو کرپٹ کہنے سے بات نہیں بنے گی کارکردگی دکھانی ہو گی اور یہ بات خان صاحب کو سمجھ نہیں آ رہی - تاریخ یہ مواقھے بار بار نہیں دے گی

Was Nawaz Punished for above wrong doing? Did he ever say sorry for the crimes he committed in politics. Ur claim is that because there are corrupts in PMLN/PPP so PTI is also having corrupts. Please prove corruption of any PTI person and see how many PTI supporters will defend his/her corruption, whereas the followers of Shareef and Zardari family are defending their corruption with full force and their only argument is that as they believe others are corrupts so first punish them and when no corrupt left in the world then come after corrupts in opposition parties.

 

[Awan S]

Was Nawaz Punished for above wrong doing? Did he ever say sorry for the crimes he committed in politics. Ur claim is that because there are corrupts in PMLN/PPP so PTI is also having corrupts. Please prove corruption of any PTI person and see how many PTI supporters will defend his/her corruption, whereas the followers of Shareef and Zardari family are defending their corruption with full force and their only argument is that as they believe others are corrupts so first punish them and when no corrupt left in the world then come after corrupts in opposition parties.

کیسی باتیں کر رہے ہیں ایسی چیزوں کے ثبوت نہیں ہوتے - اس وقت آرمی نے سب سیاست دانوں میں پیسے بانٹے - آئی جے آئی تو بنائی ہی فوج نے تھی نواز وغیرہ تو اس وقت فوج کے ایجنٹ تھے - ایجنٹ کو سزا اور ماسٹر مائنڈ کو کیسے چھوڑا جا سکتا ہے - یہ قیاس آرائی ہے پیسے نواز نے پیسے دئے اور دئے بھی ہونگے ورنہ بظاھر نواز اپنے ایم پی اے کو چھانگا مانگا اس لئے لے گیا کہ کوئی انہیں خرید نہ لے ووٹ ڈالنے سے پہلے - کیا اپنے یا وہ ایم پی اے جو انہیں ووٹ دینا چاہتے ہیں انہیں چھانگا مانگا اکٹھا کر کے چند دن رکھنا جرم ہے ؟
بھائی میرے ثبوت تو کسی کی کرپشن کا کسی کی طرف سے نہیں دونوں طرف سے الزام ہے - آپ دیکھ لیں کہ دو ہزار اٹھارہ کے الیکشن سے پہلے مکمل پیپلز پارٹی پنجاب سوائے کائرہ کے تحریک انصاف میں ظم ہو گئی ، کیا وہ فرشتے تھے ، ق لیگ کافی حد تک آ گئی ، جاگیر دار اور جنہیں ہم الیکٹ ایبل کہتے ہیں وہ سب تحریک انصاف میں آ گئے - بہت سے لوگ جنہیں ڈر تھا ہماری کرپشن اب پکڑی جائے گی وہ بھی پناہ کے لئے تحریک انصاف میں آ گئے - بہت سے لیگی بھی تحریک انصاف میں گئے - نون لیگ میں تو جو رہ گئے وہی تھے جنہیں یقین تھا ان کے ہاتھ صاف ہیں ورنہ ان کا انجام کیا ہونا ہے دیوار پر لکھا تھا - اب جو تحریک انصاف میں آ گئے وہ فرشتے اور جو نون لیگ میں رہ گئے وہ کرپٹ کیا لاجک ہے - اتنی سادہ بات تو سمجھ آنی چایہے

 

[Okara]

کیسی باتیں کر رہے ہیں ایسی چیزوں کے ثبوت نہیں ہوتے - اس وقت آرمی نے سب سیاست دانوں میں پیسے بانٹے - آئی جے آئی تو بنائی ہی فوج نے تھی نواز وغیرہ تو اس وقت فوج کے ایجنٹ تھے - ایجنٹ کو سزا اور ماسٹر مائنڈ کو کیسے چھوڑا جا سکتا ہے - یہ قیاس آرائی ہے پیسے نواز نے پیسے دئے اور دئے بھی ہونگے ورنہ بظاھر نواز اپنے ایم پی اے کو چھانگا مانگا اس لئے لے گیا کہ کوئی انہیں خرید نہ لے ووٹ ڈالنے سے پہلے - کیا اپنے یا وہ ایم پی اے جو انہیں ووٹ دینا چاہتے ہیں انہیں چھانگا مانگا اکٹھا کر کے چند دن رکھنا جرم ہے ؟
بھائی میرے ثبوت تو کسی کی کرپشن کا کسی کی طرف سے نہیں دونوں طرف سے الزام ہے - آپ دیکھ لیں کہ دو ہزار اٹھارہ کے الیکشن سے پہلے مکمل پیپلز پارٹی پنجاب سوائے کائرہ کے تحریک انصاف میں ظم ہو گئی ، کیا وہ فرشتے تھے ، ق لیگ کافی حد تک آ گئی ، جاگیر دار اور جنہیں ہم الیکٹ ایبل کہتے ہیں وہ سب تحریک انصاف میں آ گئے - بہت سے لوگ جنہیں ڈر تھا ہماری کرپشن اب پکڑی جائے گی وہ بھی پناہ کے لئے تحریک انصاف میں آ گئے - بہت سے لیگی بھی تحریک انصاف میں گئے - نون لیگ میں تو جو رہ گئے وہی تھے جنہیں یقین تھا ان کے ہاتھ صاف ہیں ورنہ ان کا انجام کیا ہونا ہے دیوار پر لکھا تھا - اب جو تحریک انصاف میں آ گئے وہ فرشتے اور جو نون لیگ میں رہ گئے وہ کرپٹ کیا لاجک ہے - اتنی سادہ بات تو سمجھ آنی چایہے

If there are corrupt people in PTI and PTI is not going after them, why aren't PMLN or PPP going against them in court. Keep in mind PPP is a partner with PMLN in PDM and PPP must be having proofs of corruptions who joined PTI. Also the PMLN must be having proofs of corruption for their people who joined PTI as well.
Keep in mind when PMLN was in power it was PTI who went to court against the corruption of Shareefs and now are most of them enjoying healthy environment of London?

 

[Awan S]

If there are corrupt people in PTI and PTI is not going after them, why aren't PMLN or PPP going against them in court. Keep in mind PPP is a partner with PMLN in PDM and PPP must be having proofs of corruptions who joined PTI. Also the PMLN must be having proofs of corruption for their people who joined PTI as well.
Keep in mind when PMLN was in power it was PTI who went to court against the corruption of Shareefs and now are most of them enjoying healthy environment of London?

Courts cannot do any investigations as investigative bodies of FIA and NAB are in governments control. PML-N/PPP don't have any proof against any just like common people. Similarly PTI don't have any proofs against PPP/PML-N and they rely on NAB/FIA. In current set up even Peshawar metro will not do any good where a 30 billion project was built in 100 billion and even at very low quality. I have several friends who are in Peshawar and they all say that this metro project is a piece of crap and 100% corruption in it. After public pressure in KPK, High court start investigating it although they cannot investigate much but PTI immediately took stay on it.
PTI went to court because they had Panama in hand and they asked for investigation. Don't forget that army was with PTI. When government, army, NAB and FIA are on one side then no one can do anything against the wishes of these parties. When in 2017 army went against PML-N then even government controlled NAB turned against PML-N and start opening cases against them. Pakistan is military state and entire world knows that.

 

[Okara]

Courts cannot do any investigations as investigative bodies of FIA and NAB are in governments control. PML-N/PPP don't have any proof against any just like common people. Similarly PTI don't have any proofs against PPP/PML-N and they rely on NAB/FIA. In current set up even Peshawar metro will not do any good where a 30 billion project was built in 100 billion and even at very low quality. I have several friends who are in Peshawar and they all say that this metro project is a piece of crap and 100% corruption in it. After public pressure in KPK, High court start investigating it although they cannot investigate much but PTI immediately took stay on it.
PTI went to court because they had Panama in hand and they asked for investigation. Don't forget that army was with PTI. When government, army, NAB and FIA are on one side then no one can do anything against the wishes of these parties. When in 2017 army went against PML-N then even government controlled NAB turned against PML-N and start opening cases against them. Pakistan is military state and entire world knows that.

Then how Nawaz was punished if FIA/NAB was under government's control? Oh sorry, during PMLN time, NAB and FIA was independent which is not the case with PTI. Right?

 

[Awan S]

Then how Nawaz was punished if FIA/NAB was under government's control? Oh sorry, during PMLN time, NAB and FIA was independent which is not the case with PTI. Right?

In every government FIA/NAB were in government control. Their was an exception when army took control of everything in 2017-20188 and even NAB started opening cases against PML-N people in their last year of government. NAB was silent until the last year, does not it ring a bell in your mind. The current government is in the same path, they are even worse that they forgot to pay attention on governance/economy and only focusing on putting PML-N people in jail and NRO. Is this important for PM to go to KPK to investigate why he lost election? Is it also important for PM to continue comments on Daska election? Khan has deviated from his path which we expected from him.

 

[Okara]

In every government FIA/NAB were in government control. Their was an exception when army took control of everything in 2017-20188 and even NAB started opening cases against PML-N people in their last year of government. NAB was silent until the last year, does not it ring a bell in your mind. The current government is in the same path, they are even worse that they forgot to pay attention on governance/economy and only focusing on putting PML-N people in jail and NRO. Is this important for PM to go to KPK to investigate why he lost election? Is it also important for PM to continue comments on Daska election? Khan has deviated from his path which we expected from him.

Despite Army which means COAS was against PMLN during 2017-2018 but they voted on his extension. Is this PMLN a party of Majzoobs?

 

[Awan S]

Despite Army which means COAS was against PMLN during 2017-2018 but they voted on his extension. Is this PMLN a party of Majzoobs?

PML-N is in trouble and they want to use any opportunity to please army as they understand until army is with government , they cannot get anything. Nawaz was frustrated and he went all out against army. I think there was a thought that you will not get anything until you show your strength. There was another thought that defaming army will stop them interfering in politics which indirectly means stop supporting PTI. I think last objective is achieved as army was neutral in GB elections, By-elections and now likely to stay away from senate elections. I strongly believe army is not trained to run the governments and they should stay away from politics. I am with army but against their political interference. No country in the world has progressed where army dictatorship was ruling the country or hijacking political process.

 

[Okara]

PML-N is in trouble and they want to use any opportunity to please army as they understand until army is with government , they cannot get anything. Nawaz was frustrated and he went all out against army. I think there was a thought that you will not get anything until you show your strength. There was another thought that defaming army will stop them interfering in politics which indirectly means stop supporting PTI. I think last objective is achieved as army was neutral in GB elections, By-elections and now likely to stay away from senate elections. I strongly believe army is not trained to run the governments and they should stay away from politics. I am with army but against their political interference. No country in the world has progressed where army dictatorship was ruling the country or hijacking political process.

This means if Army was supporting PMLN then they are not going to vote in favor of COAS Gen Bajwa's extension?

 

[Awan S]

This means if Army was supporting PMLN then they are not going to vote in favor of COAS Gen Bajwa's extension?

They were supposed to vote to army chief's extension either way. They voted army chief's extension and in a return got Nawaz out of country. It was in the best interest of both parties. It looks like army will not interfere much in future politics. There are two reasons:
(1) They brought Khan and Khan failed. People start criticising army from all four provinces
(2) Opposition start bashing army by taking names

Let us hope elections are free and fair and army does not interfere on civilian matters.

 

[Okara]

They were supposed to vote to army chief's extension either way. They voted army chief's extension and in a return got Nawaz out of country. It was in the best interest of both parties. It looks like army will not interfere much in future politics. There are two reasons:
(1) They brought Khan and Khan failed. People start criticising army from all four provinces
(2) Opposition start bashing army by taking names

Let us hope elections are free and fair and army does not interfere on civilian matters.

Nawaz left Pakistan for London on November 19, 2019 whereas the voting on the extension on the army chief took on Jan 8, 2020.
Answer to your first question: Why did Army bring Imran Khan by rigging election instead of their own Pervez Musharraf?
Answer to your 2nd question: When opposition came to know it was Army brought IK to power? In your views, Army given relief to Nawaz anticipating there will be vote in NA for the extension of COAS and PMLN will vote despite knowing Army brought IK to power. Did Army give this deal only to PMLN or other parties as well that in future if anyone sentenced to jail on corruption will be let go to London for treatment?
Last thing, please provide few suggestions to make free and fair elections.

 

[Awan S]

Nawaz left Pakistan for London on November 19, 2019 whereas the voting on the extension on the army chief took on Jan 8, 2020.
Answer to your first question: Why did Army bring Imran Khan by rigging election instead of their own Pervez Musharraf?
Answer to your 2nd question: When opposition came to know it was Army brought IK to power? In your views, Army given relief to Nawaz anticipating there will be vote in NA for the extension of COAS and PMLN will vote despite knowing Army brought IK to power. Did Army give this deal only to PMLN or other parties as well that in future if anyone sentenced to jail on corruption will be let go to London for treatment?
Last thing, please provide few suggestions to make free and fair elections.

Yes Nawaz went first and voting was later but that was part of the deal. Why PML-N voted army chief extension then?
Pervaiz Musharf cannot be bring as he has zero popularity in entire Pakistan. Army can make 60 to 100 but cannot make 0 to 100. It was clear in 2013 elections that Pervaiz Musharaf cannot win at all. They did not tried to PML-Q even as they knew that they have their base only in Gunjrat and little bit more in other areas.
There is continuous negotiations goes on as PML-N has a lot of pro- army people within it. Shahbaz Sharif and Khwaja Asif are pro-army in Nawaz camp for example. PML-N never ever disconnected with army completely but they were not their own party like in 1990. You can see hundreds of X-army or on job men in Khan government and Khan party is completely a King's party like it was PMLQ in 2002 and PML-N in 1990.
PML-N is Punjab party and every component of establishment including army has soft corner for PML-N. PML-N still got one crore 29 lakh votes in 2018, only 30 lakh votes less than Khan party despite a strong political engineering against them. Musharaf has also tried to dump this party but they came back strong. I think Musharaf performance was better than Khan government and even if they cannot stop PML-N then it will be hard to dump them for ever. They are strong public voice and let the people decide who they want.

 

[Okara]

Yes Nawaz went first and voting was later but that was part of the deal. Why PML-N voted army chief extension then?
Pervaiz Musharf cannot be bring as he has zero popularity in entire Pakistan. Army can make 60 to 100 but cannot make 0 to 100. It was clear in 2013 elections that Pervaiz Musharaf cannot win at all. They did not tried to PML-Q even as they knew that they have their base only in Gunjrat and little bit more in other areas.
There is continuous negotiations goes on as PML-N has a lot of pro- army people within it. Shahbaz Sharif and Khwaja Asif are pro-army in Nawaz camp for example. PML-N never ever disconnected with army completely but they were not their own party like in 1990. You can see hundreds of X-army or on job men in Khan government and Khan party is completely a King's party like it was PMLQ in 2002 and PML-N in 1990.
PML-N is Punjab party and every component of establishment including army has soft corner for PML-N. PML-N still got one crore 29 lakh votes in 2018, only 30 lakh votes less than Khan party despite a strong political engineering against them. Musharaf has also tried to dump this party but they came back strong. I think Musharaf performance was better than Khan government and even if they cannot stop PML-N then it will be hard to dump them for ever. They are strong public voice and let the people decide who they want.

Awan Sahib,
How were Nawaz and Army knowing that there will be court decision for Vote on COAS extension during discussions between them?
Nawaz Left Pakistan on Nov 19th, 2019
Supreme Court Decision was Nov 28th, 2019
Voting Took Place on Jan 8th, 2020

 

[Awan S]

Awan Sahib,
How were Nawaz and Army knowing that there will be court decision for Vote on COAS extension during discussions between them?
Nawaz Left Pakistan on Nov 19th, 2019
Supreme Court Decision was Nov 28th, 2019
Voting Took Place on Jan 8th, 2020

Very confused how it happened. I am sure Khan was not in favour to let Nawaz go and only army forced him to do so. If you remember that time Khan went to court which was not part of deal with army. In the end Khan was sent to 3 day vacation so that he cannot create any further mess. If you believe PML-N did not vote army in return to Nawaz's exile then I don't see any other reason.