Documentary on the Kalash people of Pakistan(Hindu kush region)

[Masud Javed]

 

[Vitamin_C]

Is it true that Kalash people are forced to study Islam in their public schools? If this is true its very sad. The people there should have a say in what their kids are being taught in their schools.

There are only 3800 Kalash left and we are killing their culture by indoctrinating them into the mainstream culture. In 1950 there were over 50,000 Kalash. This jahalat of Zia and Mullahism couldnt even spare the smallest religious minority in Pakistan.

Start from 3:21

 

[Dr Adam]

If murtadeens are given free hand to preach their bull then it will be Kosher for those people I guess.

Islam is.... "siraat e mustaqeem". If taught to anyone to show the light then what is the problem with murtadeens?

 

[shujauddin]

People change their religion to mix with the majority and better their future prospects and Kalash are no different. Paganism is not so resilient and that's why their numbers are dwindling. I can give u an example, a lot of Chinese when they come to Canada or USA they voluntarily accept Christianity. It is very possible that Kalash people are choosing islam on their own. I was in Karachi and our local imam was a converted Kalash.

 

[shujauddin]

The youth are migrating and no longer want to be a show piece for tourists. They want to progress to - adopt better ideologies and become part of the mainstream.

 

[Vitamin_C]

Thats not what I am talking about.

Im talking about forcing Kalash to be indoctrinated into another religion by the government.

Kalash do not have organized religion but they do have their culture and identity and our draconian laws are contributing to its demise

People change their religion to mix with the majority and better their future prospects and Kalash are no different. Paganism is not so resilient and that's why their numbers are dwindling. I can give u an example, a lot of Chinese when they come to Canada or USA they voluntarily accept Christianity. It is very possible that Kalash people are choosing islam on their own. I was in Karachi and our local imam was a converted Kalash.

 

[shujauddin]

Thats not what I am talking about.

Im talking about forcing Kalash to be indoctrinated into another religion by the government.

Kalash do not have organized religion but they do have their culture and identity and our draconian laws are contributing to its demise

I saw another documentary where locals were interviewed and they themselves accepted that :
" A lot of their youth are migrating to cities for better future and no longer adhere to paganism "
Moreover, we cannot force them to stay pagan just because Tourists like it? let it be free flow and let them decide for themselves.

As I said earlier, Paganism has next to zero chances of survival in the modern world. Nobody is forcing them to be Muslims.

 

[Vitamin_C]

Thats what you believe and you have a right to it. Majority of the world will disagree with your believe and they have a right to it too.

Dont force your beliefs on other people.

If murtadeens are given free hand to preach their bull then it will be Kosher for those people I guess.

Islam is.... "siraat e mustaqeem". If taught to anyone to show the light then what is the problem with murtadeens?

 

[Vitamin_C]

That might be the case but the question I am asking is, why is our government forcing the Kalash to study Islam?

Forcing them to be indoctrinated into a specific religion isn't foreedom of religion is it?

Might as well go piss on Quaid e Azams grave while we are at it desecrating his vision for Pakistan.

I saw another documentary where locals were interviewed and they themselves accepted that :
" A lot of their youth are migrating to cities for better future and no longer adhere to paganism "
Moreover, we cannot force they to stay pagan just because Tourists like it? let it be free flow and let them decide for themselves.

As I said earlier, Paganism has next to zero chances of survival in the modern world. Nobody is forcing them to be Muslims.

 

[shujauddin]

That might be the case but the question I am asking is, why is our government forcing the Kalash to study Islam?

Forcing them to be indoctrinated into a specific religion isn't foreedom of religion is it?

Might as well go piss on Quaid e Azams grave while we are at it desecrating his vision for Pakistan.

how are they forcing? please shed some light as I said, I have read detailed reports one from Washington post that these people voluntarily convert and leave their villages for better future. Let me try finding that study and I will post.

 

[shujauddin]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/

View of From Spirits to God: Stories of the Kalash Converts from Before and After their Conversion | Narrative Works

Please note that both references are authentic and academic rather than some thrilling NGO news story.

 

[Vitamin_C]

It is mandatory law that all kids in Kalash Valley be indoctrinated in Islam and Quran. We are indoctrinating innocent children to leave their culture and identity. They are discarding their cultural dresses for burqa. Did you not see the documentary?

how are they forcing? please shed some light as I said, I have read detailed reports one from Washington post that these people voluntarily convert and leave their villages for better future. Let me try finding that study and I will post.

 

[shujauddin]

It is mandatory law that all kids in Kalash Valley be indoctrinated in Islam and Quran. We are indoctrinating innocent children to leave their culture and identity. They are discarding their cultural dresses for burqa. Did you not see the documentary?

I did see the documentary but it is not the absolute truth. As a student of Cultural Anthropology I was very interested and talked to local Chitrali friends too and an assistant commissioner they all said that we cannot hold them captive in their villages, if they want to go out and adapt - the govt doesn't resist their migration and why should they do it? to appease tourists who come once a year? and also you would be surprised that the locals are not happy to be an Object for tourism.

 

[shujauddin]

there was a very interesting scientific study of their Y DNA analysis that debunked the popular theory that they are descendants of Greeks. The Autosomal and Y DNA results pointed more to their local origin and no Greek ancestry.

 

[Vitamin_C]

Why do you keep avoiding my question?

I did see the documentary but it is not the absolute truth. As a student of Cultural Anthropology I was very interested and talked to local Chitrali friends too and an assistant commissioner they all said that we cannot hold them captive in their villages, if they want to go out and adapt - the govt doesn't resist their migration and why should they do it? to appease tourists who come once a year? and also you would be surprised that the locals are not happy to be an Object for tourism.

 

[shujauddin]

Why do you keep avoiding my question?

Make a special syllabus for them and exempt them from Islamic and Pakistan studies, is that what you are suggesting?

 

[shujauddin]

Why do you keep avoiding my question?

Make a special sylabbus fit them and exempt them fro

If murtadeens are given free hand to preach their bull then it will be Kosher for those people I guess.

Islam is.... "siraat e mustaqeem". If taught to anyone to show the light then what is the problem with murtadeens?

Actually the Kalash people are simple and open to new ways and accepting new ideologies. Lets assume that we cut access of Muslim preachers there then what will happen next?

* Foreign Missionaries (Christians) will infiltrate and the next thing you will know that the kalasha will become Christians. A lot of NGO's might already be doing it there.
* Something similar happened in the 1970's in Gilgit and Baltistan. Agha Khanies took advantage of the vacuum and now most of them are converted Agha Khanies.

I have no problems with them getting exposed to Islam.

 

[Vitamin_C]

Thats the same thing as saying, your going to get robbed anyway by a foreign ngo, let me rob you instead.

How about teach them their own language, culture and tradition instead of brainwashing their children to follow another religion, discard their traditional dresses and wear burqa.

Kalash has already gone through alot since last 1000 years at hand of Muslims most have already been forcefully converted over last few centuries, even Taliban didnt spare them and this is the only valley left before they go extinct. Leave them alone.

There is a Kalash MPA in KPK I hope he talks some sense into Imran Khan. Saying Islam is superior to other religions or culture is wrong and goes against freedom of religion.

Make a special sylabbus fit them and exempt them fro


Actually the Kalash people are simple and open to new ways and accepting new ideologies. Lets assume that we cut access of Muslim preachers there then what will happen next?

* Foreign Missionaries (Christians) will infiltrate and the next thing you will know that the kalasha will become Christians. A lot of NGO's might already be doing it there.
* Something similar happened in the 1970's in Gilgit and Baltistan. Agha Khanies took advantage of the vacuum and now most of them are converted Agha Khanies.

I have no problems with them getting exposed to Islam.

 

[shujauddin]

Thats the same thing as saying, your going to get robbed anyway by a foreign ngo, let me rob you instead.

How about teach them their own language, culture and tradition instead of brainwashing their children to follow another religion, discard their traditional dresses and wear burqa.

Kalash has already gone through alot since last 1000 years at hand of Muslims most have already been forcefully converted over last few centuries, even Taliban didnt spare them and this is the only valley left before they go extinct. Leave them alone.

There is a Kalash MPA in KPK I hope he talks some sense into Imran Khan. Saying Islam is superior to other religions or culture is wrong and goes against freedom of religion.

Sir, if its preaching I am for it and if this is forceful conversions then I am against it.
I live in Canada, every weekend the Christian Missionaries visit the neighborhood, do small talks , distribute their material etc. , as a person of different faith I am least bothered and have no objection. To recap :
Preaching is ok and forcing others is wrong. I hope you acknowledge the difference between the two.

 

[Vitamin_C]

You are a Muslim. What if your children in Canadian schools were put through mandatory Christianity classes and Bible classes and taught those things are the truth and fact but not taught anything about Islam or Quran. Would you be okay with that?

Children are very impressionable and have plastic brains. Whatever you teach them whether its Hinduism, Christianity, Islam, they will most probably believe in it until they die.

This is what Pakistan govt has been doing to Kalash people. They are using their children to systematically eradicate their culture, language, religion, identity and history.

Sir, if its preaching I am for it and if this is forceful conversions then I am against it.
I live in Canada, every weekend the Christian Missionaries visit the neighborhood, do small talks , distribute their material etc. , as a person of different faith I am least bothered and have no objection. To recap :
Preaching is ok and forcing others is wrong. I hope you acknowledge the difference between the two.