قادیانیت اور موجودہ قادیانی

[RAKPK]

بات یہ ہے کہ خدائی تقدیر جب کام کرتی ہے تو ایسے محیر العقول کام ہوتے ہیں جن کے بارے میں انسان سوچ بھی نہیں سکتا۔ دوسری بات یہ ہے کہ 1974 میں قومی اسمبلی کے اسپیکر صاحبزادہ فاروق تھے جو ملتان کے رہنے والے تھے۔ وہ جب احمدیوں کو غیر مسلم قرار دینے کے فیصلے کے بعد ملتان پہنچے تو ائیرپورٹ پر ان سے سوال کیا گیا کہ قومی اسمبلی کی کارروائی کو کب شائع کیا جائے گا تو ان کا جواب تھا کہ اگر ہم قومی اسمبلی کی کارروائی کو شائع کر دیں تو آدھا پاکستان احمدی ہو جائے۔ یہی وجہ ہے کہ 30-35 سال تک اس کارروائی کو شائع نہیں کیا گیا۔ آج بھی اگر آپ کے پاس وقت ہو تو اس کارروائی کو جو کہ اوریجنل ہو اسے مکمل طور پر پڑھ لیں تو حقیقت آپ کے سامنے آ جائے گی کہ صاحبزادہ صاحب کی بات کس حد تک درست ہے۔ ہاں وہ کارروائی اصل ہونا ضروری ہے جو بعض مولوی حضرات نے شائع کی ہیں وہ تحریف شدہ ہے۔ میرے خیال میں اگر صرف اسمبلی کی کارروائی کو ہی نیوٹرل ہو کر مکمل طور پر پڑھ لیا جائے تو اس سے زیادہ کوئی بھی چیز بہتر فیصلہ اور رائے قائم کرنے میں معاون ثابت نہیں ہو سکتی۔

Oh really?

So Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of Qadian was not so competent or else he would have converted half of India to Ahmadiyya.

But this session of NA was so effective that it would have converted half of Pakistan to Ahmadis if published.

So what happened after 30-35 years when it was actually published?

Did half of Pakistan convert to Qadiyanism?

 

[RAKPK]

Pakistani muslims THINK they are protecting the Honor of their Prophet; however the NEW Kalimah you say when you get your passport Decides if you are a Muslim or not. The OLD Kalimah is not recognized by the state. Now, who is a Non-Muslim, the Qadiyani or the Pakistani Muslim? By islamic definition ALL recognized Muslims in Pakistan are non-muslim. All Qadiyanis are anyway non-muslim. Whoever came up with this didn't think it through. haha.

The ONLY gainer in this is the state of Pakistan. The government now has Supreme power over who is a Muslim and who is not.

You call it a kalima, we don't.

If it was not state, then it would have been Mumtaz Qadris who would be deciding who's Muslim and who's not. And then you would not be here posting on this forum.

 

[Reason]

Yes, the state may repeal this legislation. Try it.

well, I am not a state. However, you are saying, "Try it" as if it is impossible to achieve. If a true liberal political party comes to power, they will do it. I would much rather have the state focus on providing basic necessities now, and leave this for later.

 

[Reason]

You call it a kalima, we don't.

If it was not state, then it would have been Mumtaz Qadris who would be deciding who's Muslim and who's not. And then you would not be here posting on this forum.

Wow, thats you threat? Mumtaz Qadri? Who was begging for mercy from President Mamnoon. Mumtaz Qadri's fate was decided by the state, and they executed him like.

 

[Mobashir Ahmed]

اس عرصے میں معاشرے میں اتنا زہر گھول دیا گیا ہے کہ لوگ عموماً احمدیوں سے لین دین کرنا بھی پسند نہیں کرتے۔ ایک چھوٹی سی مثال یہ ہے کہ آج نواز شریف کی حکومت پانامہ لیکس ایشو کو ڈیلے کیوں کر رہی ہے؟ صرف اس لئے کہ جیسے جیسے وقت گزرے گا یہ عوام کے ذہنوں کو پانامہ لیکس کے ایشو پر منتشر کر دیں گے۔ یہی حال اسمبلی کی رپورٹ کا ہوا۔ جیسے جیسے وقت گزر جائے لوگ ایک ایشو کو آہستہ آہستہ بھول جاتے ہیں اور پھر 30 سال کا عرصے میں تو بچہ پیدا ہو کر بچوں کا باپ بن جاتا ہے۔ آخری بات یہ ہے کہ میرا تو یہی برادرانہ مشورہ ہے کہ اگر ممکن ہو تو آپ ایک بار اس رپورٹ پر نظر ضرور دوڑائیں۔ سب سے آسان طریقہ ہے احمدیوں کی حقیقت جاننے کا اور پھر یہ کہ وہ رپورٹ احمدیوں کی طرف سے نہیں بلکہ قومی اسمبلی کی طرف سے ہے۔ اس میں دونوں اطراف کے علماء کے قوی دلائل موجود ہیں اس کے علاوہ بھی بہت سے تلخ حقائق ہیں۔ وہ رپورٹ صرف پڑھنے سے تعلق رکھتی ہے اس پر بات چیت کرنے سے حقیقی مقصد حاصل نہیں ہو سکتا۔ کیونکہ حقیقی علم وہی ہوتا ہے جس کی انسان خود جستجو کرے۔ جیسے حدیث ہے کہ :سنی سنائی بات خود دیکھنے کی طرح نہیں ہوتی: بات یہ ہے کہ یہ تو ایک بحث کا سلسلہ چل پڑا ہے اس تھریڈ کے ذریعے ورنہ اس موضوع پر کون بات کر سکتا ہے۔

 

[RAKPK]

Why is 260 (3) so annoying for Qadiyanis

260 (3) is closing the door of possible success for Qadiyani faith.

When Pakistan came into being in 1947, there were many Qadiyanis in bureaucracy and armed forces.

They believed they would not let Pakistan to be an Islamic State and were working for secularisation of Pakistan.

But in 1950s there were anti Ahmedi protests which turned violent.

Then 1956 Constitution was a small blow to the Ahmadi-Secularists, as head of state had to be Muslim by law.

When Bhutto came, Qadiyanis didn't expect that this socialist cum secularist man could get them declared as Non-Muslims, but it was the will of Allah.

Pakistanis had rendered great sacrifice to declare the enemies of Islam and enemies of Muhammad pbuh as Non-Muslims.

Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of Qadian Failed

He failed because he couldn't establish his Qadiyani khilafah in Pakistan or India. His successors also failed and the Khalifah has had to live in London. They have lost all chances of any Qadiyani khilafah in Pakistan. In India, of course the Hindu regime is not so welcoming.

That's why Qadiyanis are so desperate to get the 260 (3) repealed from the Constitution of Pakistan.

 

[RAKPK]

well, I am not a state. However, you are saying, "Try it" as if it is impossible to achieve. If a true liberal political party comes to power, they will do it. I would much rather have the state focus on providing basic necessities now, and leave this for later.

That true liberal political party's head will meet Salman Taseer in, you know what I mean. It's not a threat, it's reality.

 

[RAKPK]

اس عرصے میں معاشرے میں اتنا زہر گھول دیا گیا ہے کہ لوگ عموماً احمدیوں سے لین دین کرنا بھی پسند نہیں کرتے۔ ایک چھوٹی سی مثال یہ ہے کہ آج نواز شریف کی حکومت پانامہ لیکس ایشو کو ڈیلے کیوں کر رہی ہے؟ صرف اس لئے کہ جیسے جیسے وقت گزرے گا یہ عوام کے ذہنوں کو پانامہ لیکس کے ایشو پر منتشر کر دیں گے۔ یہی حال اسمبلی کی رپورٹ کا ہوا۔ جیسے جیسے وقت گزر جائے لوگ ایک ایشو کو آہستہ آہستہ بھول جاتے ہیں اور پھر 30 سال کا عرصے میں تو بچہ پیدا ہو کر بچوں کا باپ بن جاتا ہے۔ آخری بات یہ ہے کہ میرا تو یہی برادرانہ مشورہ ہے کہ اگر ممکن ہو تو آپ ایک بار اس رپورٹ پر نظر ضرور دوڑائیں۔ سب سے آسان طریقہ ہے احمدیوں کی حقیقت جاننے کا اور پھر یہ کہ وہ رپورٹ احمدیوں کی طرف سے نہیں بلکہ قومی اسمبلی کی طرف سے ہے۔ اس میں دونوں اطراف کے علماء کے قوی دلائل موجود ہیں اس کے علاوہ بھی بہت سے تلخ حقائق ہیں۔ وہ رپورٹ صرف پڑھنے سے تعلق رکھتی ہے اس پر بات چیت کرنے سے حقیقی مقصد حاصل نہیں ہو سکتا۔ کیونکہ حقیقی علم وہی ہوتا ہے جس کی انسان خود جستجو کرے۔ جیسے حدیث ہے کہ :سنی سنائی بات خود دیکھنے کی طرح نہیں ہوتی: بات یہ ہے کہ یہ تو ایک بحث کا سلسلہ چل پڑا ہے اس تھریڈ کے ذریعے ورنہ اس موضوع پر کون بات کر سکتا ہے۔

That report is more effective than the teachings of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of Qadian?

 

[RAKPK]

Wow, thats you threat? Mumtaz Qadri? Who was begging for mercy from President Mamnoon. Mumtaz Qadri's fate was decided by the state, and they executed him like.

You know very well, how emotional Pakistanis are about the honour of their Prophet Muhammad pbuh. Mumtaz Qadri begged for his life or not, it doesn't matter. What matters is you will find thousands of Mumtaz Qadris left and right in Pakistan. That's why I say, try it.

 

[WatanDost]

جو بویا مرزا قادیانی نے وہی کاٹا

 

[lurker]

What do you call it? The Defacto Shahada (The testimony) Of being a Muslim is different than the one that exists in the Constitution of Pakistan. Therefore either 1.) The constitution of Pakistan is a Blasphemy. 2.) It does not comply with the Shariah.

Any Muslim who has a different Shahada cannot possibly be a Muslim.

You call it a kalima, we don't.

If it was not state, then it would have been Mumtaz Qadris who would be deciding who's Muslim and who's not. And then you would not be here posting on this forum.

 

[RAKPK]

Face of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of Qadian

I'm not posting his face over here, but those interested to see may google. And, I'm surprised at Qadiyanis why they believe he's their Prophet. Sorry but he looks ugly and has a disgusting face. This is because of the curse of Allah for his lies and misleading masses.

 

[RAKPK]

What do you call it? The Defacto Shahada (The testimony) Of being a Muslim is different than the one that exists in the Constitution of Pakistan. Therefore either 1.) The constitution of Pakistan is a Blasphemy. 2.) It does not comply with the Shariah.

Any Muslim who has a different Shahada cannot possibly be a Muslim.

Don't be frustrated at 260 (3), it won't change for sure, Allah willing.

Shahadah is

1. Belief in Allah as deity worthy of worship

2. Belief in Muhammad pbuh as the Messenger of Allah

Now, what you see in application forms or passport is not Shahadah. It's a proof that you're either Muslim or a Non-Muslim. It's a way to stop Qadiyanis from deceiving us. Earlier they were cheating, they were claiming to be Muslims and availing opportunities which were for Muslims only.

 

[lurker]

The Qadiyani faith succeeded. Just like the Bahai'Faith succeeded. And there will be MORE derivatives of Islam. Its the nature of Belief systems. All they require is a belief. Did you know there are places where even Superman is considered a deity? Belief systems are easy to establish. The Qadiyanis succeeded in declaring EVERY Pakistani Muslim as a Non-Muslim due to non-compliance with the Shariah in declaring of what constitutes a Muslim. One can even say the current constitution of Pakistan is in itself a Blasphemy.

Why is 260 (3) so annoying for Qadiyanis

260 (3) is closing the door of possible success for Qadiyani faith.

When Pakistan came into being in 1947, there were many Qadiyanis in bureaucracy and armed forces.

They believed they would not let Pakistan to be an Islamic State and were working for secularisation of Pakistan.

But in 1950s there were anti Ahmedi protests which turned violent.

Then 1956 Constitution was a small blow to the Ahmadi-Secularists, as head of state had to be Muslim by law.

When Bhutto came, Qadiyanis didn't expect that this socialist cum secularist man could get them declared as Non-Muslims, but it was the will of Allah.

Pakistanis had rendered great sacrifice to declare the enemies of Islam and enemies of Muhammad pbuh as Non-Muslims.

Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of Qadian Failed

He failed because he couldn't establish his Qadiyani khilafah in Pakistan or India. His successors also failed and the Khalifah has had to live in London. They have lost all chances of any Qadiyani khilafah in Pakistan. In India, of course the Hindu regime is not so welcoming.

That's why Qadiyanis are so desperate to get the 260 (3) repealed from the Constitution of Pakistan.

 

[RAKPK]

The Qadiyani faith succeeded. Just like the Bahai'Faith succeeded. And there will be MORE derivatives of Islam. Its the nature of Belief systems. All they require is a belief. Did you know there are places where even Superman is considered a deity? Belief systems are easy to establish. The Qadiyanis succeeded in declaring EVERY Pakistani Muslim as a Non-Muslim due to non-compliance with the Shariah in declaring of what constitutes a Muslim. One can even say the current constitution of Pakistan is in itself a Blasphemy.

Qadiyani faith succeeded the way TTP succeeded, and MQM succeeded. In America Homosexuality succeeded too, as it's been legalised and more followers of Homosexuality in the world than of Qadiyani faith.

 

[RAKPK]

The Qadiyani Prophet died of Diarrhea?

From a Qadiyani source:

Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, sadly passed away on 26th May 1908 at the age of 73 years old. He was to be buried in Qadian at Bahishti Maqbarah (Heavenly Graveyard), but in order to be allowed to go on the train; a doctor had to examine him to ensure he carried no contagious disease. The doctor issued a death certificate, but there was no mention of him dying by cholera (as alleged) or dying in the toilet, instead they recorded it as ‘complications arising from severe diarrhoea’. No doubt by suffering from diarrhoea it would have led to his weakness and eventual death, but that doesn’t mean that he died whilst on the toilet. That is just presumptions made by his opponents.

http://whyahmadi.org/objections-raised/he-died-in-the-toilet.html

 

[RAKPK]

Mirza Ghulam Ahmad's Prophecy Went Wrong

From a Qadiyani source:

Another accusation concerning his death is that Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad,
received a revelation that ‘he would live to be 80 or so years old’ but his opponents assert that this prophecy proved wrong and therefore it was false as he only lived for 73 years! The wording is “eighty years or a few years less or more…” (Tadhikira, pg 6) and whilst in solar years he lived for 73 years, if it is calculated in the lunar calendar then he lived for 75 years which would fulfil this prophecy of 80 years or a few years less.

http://whyahmadi.org/objections-raised/he-died-in-the-toilet.html

 

[I Love Muhammad (PBUH)]

Qadiyanis unite Pakistanis

I'm glad that this issue has united Pakistanis on this forum. Whether they are from PTI or Noon League, or any other political rivals, they all are united over the honour of the Prophet Muhammad pbuh and condemning Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of Qadian.

jazakAllah for fulfilling the prophecy of prophet Muhammad pbuh.


The Prophet (sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam) said:

The Jews split into seventy-one sects; one will be in Paradise (i.e., those who followed Moses) and seventy will be in the Fire. The Christians split into seventy-two sects; seventy-one will be in the Fire and one will be in Paradise (i.e., those who followed Jesus). And by the One in Whose Hand is the soul of Muhammad, this Ummah (nation) of mine will split into seventy-three sects; one will be in Paradise and seventy-two will be in the Fire. It was asked, Who are they, O Messenger of Allah? He (peace be upon him) said, Al-Jamaah (i.e., the group which adheres steadfastly to the way of the Prophet, peace be upon him, and his Companions). And in another narration: (Those who follow) what I and my Companions are following.



[The hadeeth is Hasan and is reported by at-Tirmidhee (no. 2643), Ibn Waddaah in al-Bidah (p. 85), al-Aajurree in ash-Shareeah (p. 15) and in al-Arbaeen, al-Haakim (1/128-129), Ibn Nasr in as-Sunnah (no. 62), al-Laalikaaee in as-Sunnah (no. 147), Ibn al-Jawzee in Talbees Iblees (p. 16) and al-Uqailee in ad-Duafaa (2/262) from the hadeeth of Abdullah ibn Amr (radhiAllahu anhu].



​

 

[I Love Muhammad (PBUH)]

ایمان کامل یقین کا نام ہے، اگر کوئی شخص شش و پنج کا شکار ہے تو اس کا ایمان مستحکم نہیں ہے۔ ہمیں کامل یقین ہے کہ نبی کریم صلی اللہ علیہ وسلم اللہ کے آخری نبی صلی اللہ علیہ وسلم ہیں، ان کے بعد کوئی نبی نہیں ہے، مہدی علیہ السلام قرب قیامت کے زمانے میں آئیں گےوہ دجا ل و مکفار کا صفایا کریں گے۔

Dear, would you please enlighten me that who will appoint Imam Mahdi ? Shia ,sunni, dev bandi , ahle hadis ?? And will it be compulsory for muslims to obey him or do bait on his hands ?

 

[RAKPK]

jazakAllah for fulfilling the prophecy of prophet Muhammad pbuh.


The Prophet (sallAllahu ‘alayhi wa sallam) said:

“The Jews split into seventy-one sects; one will be in Paradise (i.e., those who followed Moses) and seventy will be in the Fire. The Christians split into seventy-two sects; seventy-one will be in the Fire and one will be in Paradise (i.e., those who followed Jesus). And by the One in Whose Hand is the soul of Muhammad, this Ummah (nation) of mine will split into seventy-three sects; one will be in Paradise and seventy-two will be in the Fire. It was asked, “Who are they, O Messenger of Allah?” He (peace be upon him) said, “Al-Jama’ah (i.e., the group which adheres steadfastly to the way of the Prophet, peace be upon him, and his Companions).” And in another narration: ” (Those who follow) what I and my Companions are following.”​

​

​

And your group of Qadian adheres to the way of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad.