Don't have to prove jackshit to mushriks like you whose Prophet is Bukhari and Quran is hadith garbage books
So you're just going to totally ignore my reply, got it for future reference.JazakAllah khair for for your in-depth analysis — it’s a discussion that’s not just about ideology but about responsibility, and I genuinely respect your commitment to preserving the truth.
On Your First Point:
You’re right — when individuals actively spread anti-Sunnah or anti-Hadith content in public, especially with arrogance or mockery, it’s not the same as someone quietly questioning or doubting. These cases require public counter-narratives, and I fully support firm intellectual rebuttal when it comes to misleading the ummah.
But I also believe not every viewer of those clips is beyond reach. There are young Muslims who stumble across these ideas and get drawn in. Our tone matters, not for the sake of the preacher, but for the hearts of those listening.
Yes, Rasulullah ﷺ and the sahaba did not tolerate Musaylima, but let's remember:
That's not the same as someone denying the authority of Hadith — a grave mistake, yes, but not equivalent to false prophethood and armed rebellion. Let's be careful not to overextend analogies.
- He claimed prophethood,
- Had a military and political rebellion,
- And split the Muslim Ummah after the Prophet’s ﷺ death.
Even then, Abu Bakr رضي الله عنه sent an army after exhausting attempts at unification. Today, our tools are words, not swords, and our battlefield is the internet, not Yamama.
You’re absolutely right again — forums like this amplify voices. That’s why I agree that refutation must be firm, informed, and public. But how we refute still matters.
If we refute with:
My “dual approach” isn’t passive — it’s just tactical. Like Ali رضي الله عنه said:
- Knowledge → it educates.
- Character → it inspires.
- Mockery or rage → it alienates.
We must shut down falsehood — no doubt. But we should never shut the door of da’wah to those who might one day return, even if they’re loud today.
At the end of the day, we both seek to defend the Deen. We just differ slightly on the methods. Humility doesn’t weaken your message — it amplifies it. When Muslims approach others with dignity and sincerity, even hearts like that of Joram van Klaveren — once a far-right Dutch politician opposed to Islam — can open to the truth. His journey to Islam didn’t begin with condemnation, but with respectful dialogue and introspection.
May Allah purify our intentions, sharpen our strategies, and protect the Ummah from misguidance — internal and external.
Wassalam.
What are you wasting your time with this obozo-x. Just another religious patwari
Not at all, brother.
Do any of the Hadith deniers here, publicly posting clips and messages, fall into the category of “innocently misguided”? And yes, forums are public megaphones — I agree we must not let misguidance spread unchecked. Refutation is necessary and should be public, clear, and grounded in ilm.
I think you mistook obozo-x's post for mine and did some hadith based ego massaging for him. My post is #70 in this thread.Not at all, brother.
To clarify: I wasn’t ignoring your reply — I was responding to the core of it as I understood it, especially your analogy with Musaylima al-Kazzab, your view of public “preachers” on this forum, and your emphasis on ideological defense in public spaces.
That said, let me address your earlier point more directly:
— In most cases, no. You're right — many are knowingly propagating a narrative with confidence and often contempt for tradition. That does put them in a different category than someone silently confused or unsure.
My only concern is that in our effort to correct, we don’t slam every door — not for them necessarily, but for those silently reading and learning from the sidelines.
I hope this clears up any misunderstanding. I'm not defending the “preachers” — I’m just reminding myself and all of us to always calibrate firmness with wisdom, as the Prophet ﷺ did.
BarakAllahu feek.
PTI supporters are on target here.
The parwezis here are saying blasphemous things about sahaba who are the narrators of not only hadith but also preservers of Quran.JazakAllah khair for for your in-depth analysis — it’s a discussion that’s not just about ideology but about responsibility, and I genuinely respect your commitment to preserving the truth.
You’re right — when individuals actively spread anti-Sunnah or anti-Hadith content in public, especially with arrogance or mockery, it’s not the same as someone quietly questioning or doubting. These cases require public counter-narratives, and I fully support firm intellectual rebuttal when it comes to misleading the ummah.
But I also believe not every viewer of those clips is beyond reach. There are young Muslims who stumble across these ideas and get drawn in.
Sir, you're so naive. Parwezis, qadiyanis etc they do end up creating their own prophets. Once you deny Prophet SAW and his teachings, next natural step is declaring your own prophet.Our tone matters, not for the sake of the preacher, but for the hearts of those listening.
Yes, Rasulullah ﷺ and the sahaba did not tolerate Musaylima, but let's remember:
- He claimed prophethood,
- Had a military and political rebellion,
- And split the Muslim Ummah after the Prophet’s ﷺ death.
Ameen.
