Rearranging the Subcontinent

Rashna

Banned
Rearranging the Subcontinent


By Robert D. Kaplan
The division of the Indian subcontinent between two major states, India and Pakistan (as well as a minor one, Bangladesh), may not be history’s last word in political geography there. For, as I have previously observed, history is a record of many different spatial arrangements between the Central Asian plateau andthe Burmese jungles.

For example, Pakistan can only be considered artificial if one is ignorant of the past in the region. Pakistan is merely the latest of various states and civilizations anchored either in the Indus River valley or in that of the Ganges. The chieftaincies of the late fourth to mid-second millennium B.C., comprising the Harappan civilization, stretched from Balochistan northeast up to Kashmir and southeast almost to Delhi and Mumbai — that is, greatly overlapping both present-day Pakistan and India.

From the fourth to the second century B.C., large areas of Afghanistan, Pakistan and India all fell under Mauryan rule. There was, too, the Kushan Empire, whose Indo-European rulers governed at times from what used to be Soviet Central Asia all the way to Bihar in northeastern India. And so it goes: For so much of history, there was simply no border between Afghanistan, Pakistan and the northern third of India — the heart of the Gangetic state.
india_pakistan_afghan_bangladesh.jpg


And whereas the geography between Afghanistan and northern India was often politically united, the geography between today’s northern India and southern India was often divided. The point is, nothing we see on the current map should be taken for granted or, for that matter, is particularly anchored in history.

It was the British who actually created what in logistical terms is the subcontinent, uniting what is now India, Pakistan and Bangladesh in the late 19th century through a massive railway grid that stretched from the Afghan border in the northwest to the Palk Strait near Sri Lanka in the deep south, and from Karachi in Pakistan to Chittagong in Bangladesh.

(The Mughals and the Delhi sultanate also unified many of these areas, but through a looser system of control.) Because Afghanistan was ultimately unconquerable by British forces in the 19th century and also had a difficult terrain, it was left out of this modern railway civilization. But don’t assume that this particular British paradigm will last forever.

In fact, it has been crumbling for decades already. Pakistan’s de facto separation from Afghanistan began to end somewhat with the Soviet invasion of the latter country in December 1979, which ignited a refugee exodus down the Khyber and other passes that disrupted Pakistani politics and worked to further erode the frontier between the Pashtuns in southern and eastern Afghanistan and the Pashtuns in western Pakistan.

By serving as a rear base for the Afghan mujahideen fighting the Soviets during that decadelong war, which I covered first hand, the Soviet-Afghan war helped radicalize politics inside Pakistan itself. Johns Hopkins University Professor Jakub Grygiel observes that when states involve themselves for years on end in irregular, decentralized warfare, central control weakens. For a concentrated and conventional threat creates the need to match it with a central authority of its own.

But the opposite kind of threat can lead to the opposite kind of result. And because of the anarchy in Afghanistan in the 1990s following the Soviet departure and the continuation of fighting and chaos in the decade following 9/11, Pakistan has had to deal with irregular, decentralizing warfare across a very porous border for more than a third of a century now. Moreover, with American troops reducing their footprint in Afghanistan, the viability of Afghanistan could possibly weaken further, with a deleterious effect on Pakistan.

This raises the question of the viability of Pakistan itself and, by association, the continued existence of the current hard-and-fast borders of India, especially given that Bangladesh as well is, in relative terms, a weak and artificially conceived state in almost never-ending turmoil.

Pakistan is not necessarily artificial, of course. As Stratfor has written, Pakistan is the demographic and national embodiment of all the Muslim invasions that have passed down into India through much of history. It is artificial only to the extent that this vast Muslim demography, rather than configuring with a state, extends all the way from Anatolia to central India, and thus the specific borders of Pakistan only work to the extent that Pakistan is reasonably well governed, with responsive bureaucratic institutions, and possesses a civil society that reaches into the tribal hinterlands. But that is demonstrably not the case.


So Afghanistan truly matters, if not necessarily to American grand strategy than to the political destiny of Pakistan and thus to the Greater Indian subcontinent.
A post-American Afghanistan means a number of things. It means some further consolidation of Iranian influence in the western and central parts of the country and an extension of some Iranian influence in eastern Afghanistan as well.

This is because Pakistan will be frustrated in projecting even more influence into eastern and southern Afghanistan because of its own Taliban problem on its side of the border. In the 1990s, Pakistan could simply provide logistical and other means of support to the Afghan Taliban; now it is not so easy. At the same time, though, the Saudis will work through the Pakistanis to project whatever influence they can in Afghanistan. And Russia, through the Central Asian republics —

whose ethnic groups have compatriots inside northern Afghanistan — might exert more influence, too. India will work with both the Iranians and the Russians to exert its own influence as a limiting factor to that of the Pakistanis and the Saudis, even as the Pakistanis lately try to balance between the Iranians and the Saudis. Such competing outside influences and interferences may tend to work against central control from Kabul rather than in support of it. And an Afghanistan in partial chaos — let alone a complete state breakdown — may work over time to further destabilize Pakistan.

Of course, Pakistan would not suddenly collapse in this scenario. But it could decay in an exceedingly gradual way that its supporters and attendant area experts might at first be able to deny, even as the evolving mundane facts on the ground would be undeniable. The signs of decay are electricity outages, water shortages, a further deterioration of the urban environment, the inability to travel here and there in outlying areas because of security issues, the inability to get much done at a government office without a bribe or a fixer.

Pakistan has experienced such phenomena for decades already; the key will be the increase or decrease in their intensity. A state that cannot monopolize the use of forceand cannot supply adequate public services is weak. Pakistan we know is weak, despite the strengthening of its democracy and civil society in recent years. It already has ongoing insurgencies in the tribal areas, in Balochistan and in Karachi.

But will it become steadily weaker? Because prime ministers and presidents come and go, I am thinking beyond the high politics in Islamabad, New Delhi and Kabul and am more concerned with the granular, ground level reality in places such as Karachi or Quetta, or in the other parts of Sind and Balochistan.

What would a terminally diseased Pakistani state come to look like?

It might see more feisty regionalism in the southern provinces of Balochistan and Sind, whose leaders told me on a trip through the area some years ago that they would prefer over time a closer relationship with New Delhi than with Islamabad. These are people who never accepted a strong Pakistani state to begin with and always advocated more federalism.

With Balochistan and Sind moving closer to India, and the Afghanistan-Pakistan Pashtun border area in permanent disarray because of turmoil inside Afghanistan according to such a scenario, then a rump state of Greater Punjab might begin to emerge — again, denied for years by officials up until the point that it is undeniable.

India, of course, would not like any of this. Top officials of responsible states — which India certainly is — prefer the status quo and quiescent borders, not their opposite. But India might at some point in the 21st century have no choice but to confront Pakistan’s partial dissolution, and that would irrevocably change India.

Because geopolitics values not the ceremonial statements of leaders but the reality of control on the ground, the Indian subcontinent will continue to fascinate. It is important to note here Henry Kissinger’s view on India in his latest book, World Order: “India will be a fulcrum of twenty-first-century order: an indispensable element, based on its geography, resources, and tradition of sophisticated leadership, in the strategic and ideological evolution of the regions and the concepts of order at whose intersection it stands.



http://www.forbes.com/sites/stratfor/2014/12/24/rearranging-the-subcontinent/
 
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GreenMaple

Prime Minister (20k+ posts)
If Pakistan breaks up then India will also split into many states. There are a lot more separation movements in India (last count is around 14), and they are only suppressed by use of force. By the way, Pakistan nation is more united than most Indians or others think. Of course we have some internal issues but with political will they are not insurmountable. Pakistan's ethnic makeup is no different than that of India's. What geopolitical principles apply to India are also applicable to Pakistan and vice versa.
 

greenstar

MPA (400+ posts)
The article was out of focus, and dealt with too many issues at the same time.

The article fails to predict the future. However, the the author is right that there is a real danger of Pakistan being balkanized because all its neighbours except china are becoming hostile and its corrupt elite does not care.

However, if Pakistan does come dangerously close to disintegration, Pakistan will dismember Afghanistan either by annexing Pashtun provinces or making them an independent country.

This will ensure that insurgency in KP and Balochistan will subside and Pakistan will be saved to a great extent. So, in the long term, Pakistan might have to break Afghanistan for its own good.

So underestimating Pakistan will be a colossal blunder.
 
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RUMIjee

MPA (400+ posts)
Robert David Kaplan is a Zionist Jew working for Mossad...what do you expect? In actuality I see the map of the middle east without Israel.
 

Saadbaloch

Senator (1k+ posts)
[h=1]China should disintegrate India: Strategist[/h]

In an article likely to raise Indian hackles, a Chinese strategist contends that Beijing should break up India into 20-30 independent states with the help of "friendly countries" like Pakistan, Bangladesh, Nepal and Bhutan.

The publication of the article nearly coincided with the 13th round of India-China border talks that ended in New Delhi on Saturday on a positive note, with Beijing emphasizing the need to build strategic trust and elevate strategic partnership to a new level to include coordination on global issues.
Written in Chinese, the article, "If China takes a little action, the so-called Great Indian Federation can be broken up," is published in the new edition of the website of the China International Institute for Strategic Studies (CIISS), an influential think tank that advises Beijing on global and strategic issues.
According to D S Rajan, director of the Chennai Centre for China Studies, Chennai, Zhan Lue, the author of the article, argues that the "so-called" Indian nation cannot be considered as one having existed in history as it relies primarily on Hindu religion for unity.
The article says that India could only be termed a "Hindu religious state" that is based on caste exploitation and which is coming in the way of modernisation.
The writer goes on to argue that with these caste cleavages in mind, China in its own interest and the progress of whole of Asia should join forces with "different nationalities" like Assamese, Tamils and Kashmiris and support them in establishing independent nation states of their own.
In particular, the article asks Beijing to support the United Liberation Front of Asom (ULFA), a militant separatist group in the Indian northeast, to it achieve independence for Assam from India.

Furthermore, the article suggests that China can give political support to Bangladesh to encourage ethnic Bengalis in India get rid of "Indian control" and unite with Bangladesh as one Bengali nation.
If this is not possible, the creation of at least another free Bengali nation state as a friendly neighbour of Bangladesh would be desirable for the purpose of weakening India's expansion and threat aimed at forming a "unified South Asia", the article argues.
The article recommends India's break up into 20-30 nation-states like in Europe and contends that if the consciousness of "nationalities" in India could be aroused, social reforms in South Asia can be achieved, the caste system can be eradicated and the region can march towards prosperity.
The Chinese strategist suggests that to split India, China can seek support of friendly countries including Pakistan, Nepal and Bhutan.
China should encourage Bangladesh to give a push to the independence of West Bengal and recover the 90,000 sq km territory in Arunachal Pradesh, which China calls southern Tibet, says Rajan who has analysed the article for the Chennai-based think tank.
"The write-up could not have been published without the permission of the Chinese authorities, but it is sure that Beijing will wash its hands out of this if the matter is taken up by New Delhi," says Rajan.
"It has generally been seen that China is speaking in two voices -- its diplomatic interlocutors have always shown understanding in their dealings with their Indian counterparts, but its media is pouring venom on India," says Rajan.
Which one to believe is a question confronting the public opinion and even policy makers in India, Rajan says, adding that ignoring such an article will "prove to be costly" for India.
 

Saadbaloch

Senator (1k+ posts)
Pakistan is not a Country its an ideology, countries can be broken but ideologies cant be. If Pakistan get disintegrated (which is impossible) it will re-emerge bigger and stronger and will include Delhi and many other areas of India as well.
Pakistan is like an eye sore for Baniyas because Baniyas knows Pakistan is actively involved in planning to disntegrate the fake fragile and un-natural union of India and will succeed in next 10 years or less for sure. how come a union like India can survive where peoples cant even under 1 language. Sounthern think Northese are black and ulgy and Northese think Southersn are half caste children of Afghans and Persians etc. and northeasrens are already on the way of announcing their independence, Sikhs are due fo rtheir referendun in 2020 and Tamils are active in Tamil Eelam movements and its gaining more and more support from Tamils.
 

GreenMaple

Prime Minister (20k+ posts)
Pakistan is not a Country its an ideology, countries can be broken but ideologies cant be. If Pakistan get disintegrated (which is impossible) it will re-emerge bigger and stronger and will include Delhi and many other areas of India as well.
Pakistan is like an eye sore for Baniyas because Baniyas knows Pakistan is actively involved in planning to disntegrate the fake fragile and un-natural union of India and will succeed in next 10 years or less for sure. how come a union like India can survive where peoples cant even under 1 language. Sounthern think Northese are black and ulgy and Northese think Southersn are half caste children of Afghans and Persians etc. and northeasrens are already on the way of announcing their independence, Sikhs are due fo rtheir referendun in 2020 and Tamils are active in Tamil Eelam movements and its gaining more and more support from Tamils.

Well said sir; hats off to you for stating cause of Pakistan so eloquently.
 

modern.fakir

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
(clap)(clap)..This coming from a Patriotic Pakistani and a baloch !- is even a more Royal Slap on the face of the Rapist Banya !

Pakistan is not a Country its an ideology, countries can be broken but ideologies cant be. If Pakistan get disintegrated (which is impossible) it will re-emerge bigger and stronger and will include Delhi and many other areas of India as well.
Pakistan is like an eye sore for Baniyas because Baniyas knows Pakistan is actively involved in planning to disntegrate the fake fragile and un-natural union of India and will succeed in next 10 years or less for sure. how come a union like India can survive where peoples cant even under 1 language. Sounthern think Northese are black and ulgy and Northese think Southersn are half caste children of Afghans and Persians etc. and northeasrens are already on the way of announcing their independence, Sikhs are due fo rtheir referendun in 2020 and Tamils are active in Tamil Eelam movements and its gaining more and more support from Tamils.
 

shafi3859

Minister (2k+ posts)
Shahida Toosy (comment on Dr. Moeed's Post)

I have have read a couple of articles by Robert Kaplan.. However what you must know that 5 thousand years ago and onwards Northern India was always a part of the kingdoms of Parthia and Bactria.. Which is Iran, Khorasan and Afghanistan. Till about 12th century Lahore was a part of Persian empires.. this is from my my broad memory of Islamic history. India was only once United by the Mauryans.. and even that was when the Greek influence had weakened. Culturally and genetically people of Pakistan are closer to the Persians Afghans and Central Asians. This was one if the reasons for the partition of India.. Much as Indians resent the division of India the fact us that PAKISTANIS are a very different from Indians. You can judge by the behavior of those who are on this page that how different we are. Having lived and worked abroad for several decades I can tell you and even Western people can tell the difference between the nature and behavior of Indians and Pakistanis. Indians are a different kettle of fish altogether. Nawaz Sharif has been blinded by his greed.. Believe me we have very little or nothing in common with Indians. However I think Americans would be well advised to look at their own history and question their own right the the country and continent called America .. This land belongs to the Native Red Indians..and these persecuted migrants from Europe have absolutely no right on this continent and they are such a hitch pitch of nationalities that to cement them together they are having to invent foreign BOGEY MEN.. May I advise you that do not be impressed with US .. other than their advances in Science and Technology. Europeans known as white Anglo Saxon persons ie WASPS should all over the world question the justification of European occupation of the Americas and Australia .. and the ruination of Africa before they open their big mouths to pronounce doom and gloom over other people's and nations. US has the most ignorant and biased media and equally ignorant population. Only the coastal areas has intellect and knowledge the rest do not even know the history or events of their own state or city. They love statistics and computer generated models of human behavior ..believe me it does not work like that at all. What of the U.S. Blunders of invasion if Afghanistan and Iraq.. They killed one million Iraqi men because according to figures in Lancet in 2008/2009 there were one million women who had been widowed.. US and UK too said very callously that they had not been counting the loss if life in Afghanistan and Iraq!! How does that make you feel about these so called civilized countries who have embarked on liberating the men and women from oppressive regimes???? Do not go there ..you have a beautiful country and lots and lots of talent ..try and work the problems through.. Start with corruption and greed.. the rest will fall in place.
 

Humi

Prime Minister (20k+ posts)
well Indo-Pak do have a chance of breaking apart even further...who knows...the future might hold many surprises...
 

Humi

Prime Minister (20k+ posts)
Pakistan is not a Country its an ideology, countries can be broken but ideologies cant be. If Pakistan get disintegrated (which is impossible) it will re-emerge bigger and stronger and will include Delhi and many other areas of India as well.
Pakistan is like an eye sore for Baniyas because Baniyas knows Pakistan is actively involved in planning to disntegrate the fake fragile and un-natural union of India and will succeed in next 10 years or less for sure. how come a union like India can survive where peoples cant even under 1 language. Sounthern think Northese are black and ulgy and Northese think Southersn are half caste children of Afghans and Persians etc. and northeasrens are already on the way of announcing their independence, Sikhs are due fo rtheir referendun in 2020 and Tamils are active in Tamil Eelam movements and its gaining more and more support from Tamils.

just out of curiosity, how do you explain the creation of Bangladesh then?
 

desan

President (40k+ posts)
Admin is quite quick to move, merge and delete relevant threads, but become quite lazy with these kinds of irrelevant ones...

 

Shah Shatranj

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
We have been listening this kind of bullshits since 1947.
If u dream to destroy Pakistan it will not stop destruction of India in parts like Khalistan, Naxalbara..........
Soon India will die under its own weight billions poor will eat each other even democracy will not help then Modi will realize that it would be worth to develop humans than to develop defense
Resident Evil(Indian poor)
coming soon in India
 

gZionist

Banned
Sindh and Balochistan would be part of Greater India.

Pakistan would be cut to Punjabistan & Pakhtoons would joint Afghanistan..
 

trippleonebrigade

Councller (250+ posts)
Sindh and Balochistan would be part of Greater India.

Pakistan would be cut to Punjabistan & Pakhtoons would joint Afghanistan..


يہ خواب ديکھتے ديکھتے تمھارے آباؤ اجداد فوت ہوچکے تم بھي ہوجاؤ گے ليکن خواب تو خواب ہوتے ہيں اور خواب ديکھنے پر پابندي نہيں ديکھتے جاؤ منے
 

modern.fakir

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
The original Pakistan resolution by the All India Muslim League asked for the creation of 2 muslim countries called Pakistan and Bangalistan, because 2 countries were always going to be difficult to manage with a hostile neighbour in between (India) and specially after the dissolution of the ALL POWERFULL Muslim Ottomon empire who had supported the Mughals ideologically and geopolitically .

OPen a Map and take a look at How bangladesh is SURROUNDED by India. The British had set us up for failure from day one !! So it was always meant to happen UNLESS Pakistan had a magic wand or the Nuclear Threshold which came pretty later.

That was something destined to happen ...many Aulia Allah had predicted this, hence it did !.....and one thing they have all predicted is the returning of the India to the Muslim fold :biggthumpup:

The sons of Tipu, ghauri, abdali and Ghaznavi are rising again - The world is jealous, the banya is upset [hilar][hilar]....BUT when Allah swt wills for something he says "Be" and it is !


just out of cu(riosity, how do you explain the creation of Bangladesh then?
 

Saadbaloch

Senator (1k+ posts)
just out of curiosity, how do you explain the creation of Bangladesh then?

Well Creation of Bangladesh was a Political blunder committed by power hungry, egoistic and inexperienced politicians. and it was nothing more than a splitting of the Property we inherited. It had to happened no country can survive whos other half is divided by a 1000 Miles of a ghatiya enemy's land.
If its Bangladesh or Pakistan these are homes for Muslims, that was the original Idea which stands still and will live till day of judgment. Yes if Bangladesh had decided to rejoin India then we could say Separate Homes for Muslims ideology died, but Baniyas knew if they occupied Bangladesh it will re-emerge as a bigger and stronger and will include Indian Bangal and all Northeastern states as well.
 

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