Was it wise for us to send president to china to celebrate victory of china against our friend japan

[arafay]

mujhe tu samaj nahi araha ke pakistan akhir china ki itni ziyada TC kyun kar raha ha. is tarhan ki lopsided policies ki waja se isolation me chalay jatay hain. humko india se seekhna chahiye jisne ne ek simultaneously russia, china, usa ko raam kiya hua ha. balke israel aur uae/saudia se bhi achay relations banaliye ha.

 

[Lord Botta]

شیخ صاحب آپ کے بارے میں میرا یہ تاثر روز بروز گہرا ہوتا جا رہا ہے کہ آپ کسی پاگل خانے میں مقیم ہیں اور جب آپ کو رفع حاجت کی ضرورت محسوس ہوتی ہے تو بیت الخلا جانے کی بجاے کمپوٹر کھول کر بیٹھ جاتے ہیں

 

[Sachbolo]

We waited and waited and waited but neither USA nor china helped us in in 1971 , china used us to get rid of India in 1965 after its 1962 war with India , from then on we are battle drawn , it does not help us sufficiently to browbeat India into Kashmir solution , just barely to keep us going . I have heard ethnic Chinese say openly that china uses Pakistan .Bhutto encouraged this conflict , see other thread of mine .in the process china won double , it colonized unchallenged Muslim province of china twice our size .Ayub was receptive to Bhutto because Fatima Jinnah was a threat and Muslim leaguers ,mostly alive then had been put in jails and Kashmir was good diversion for him which Bhutto knew .

نہنے شیخ بچے یہ تیرے بس کی باات نہیں تو جا اور گلی ڈنڈا کھیل اور چولیں مارنا بند کر ہمیں پتہ ہے کہ کون دوست ہے اور کون دشمن گاڑیاں بیچنے والے کاروبار کر رہے ہیں کوی تحفہ یا عتیہ نہیں دے رہے اور چین 1965 میں ایسی قوت نہیں تھا کہ لڑای میں کودتا وہ تمہارے برسوں کے اقا امریکہ کی 7 ویں بہری بیڑا ابھی 44 سال ہو گے ہیں نہیں پہنچا انتظار جاری ہے اور چاپان اس کا بغل بچہ ہے اور اب بہارت اس کا نیا یار ہے تو تم کیا الٹی سلتی راگ الاپ رہے ہو یا تو تم انڈین ہو یا پاکستینی چولیں مارنے والے لبرل اور اسما جہانگیر جیسوں کے چیلے۔

 

[blatant]

you just chopped your own toes, and I am sure you didn't even feel it.

You probably don't realize what you wrote. I can imagine it must have a very different theme and meaning in your mind, but to commoners like me all you said is that Pakistan should become friends with India and leave China.

Guess who masterminded that philosophy.

THE SHARIFS

you are on the wrong side of history. but you don't care because you think you are right, and for you that's all what matters.

I used to treat patients in mental health units. And it was hard for me to shake their delusions at times, even at the best of times. So I guess I'll let you be in peace.

enjoy while you get some audience.

yes I have an agenda , Muslims every where should carve out their own state in the world where ever possible , they should seek friendly autonomy where this is not possible , they should not allow non Muslims to rule them , to control them or to colonize their land . If we do indeed believe that Islam is superior to all , the we should not encourage spread of other faiths and doctrines in our land . If certain powers of the world allow entry of Islam onto their land we should be friendly to them , we are bound to protect honour, propert y and life of all our citizens in including non Muslims , but we are not not obliged to do more for rivals of Islam or of Muslims . We should have preferential relations with nations of people of book over atheists , we need good relations with India as our 120 million Muslims will suffer . We should not risk Pakistan for Kashmir , unless kashmiris opt for union of Pakistan wholeheartedly and not use us for their own secular agendas , we must be wary of power of china being neighbour , history seperated us from them owing to Himalayas . They have ample people to colonize and power to crush and we are increasing their power , they will presently not disobey western powers as their prosperity depends on exports , they have already started to trouble their neighbours . China did not use UN to help any sunni Muslim cause except for Pakistan their client state . Iran was always at war with subcontinent , its shia doctrine produces competititors to prophet of Islam and its alliance with west since 1988 secretly has seen wars after wars after wars . I believe that democracy is not the same as shura of Islam , in Islam we prefer good judges and right to speak , but leaders who ever must be committed to Islam but need not be mullahs as mullahs are generally illiterate in modern sciences and arts . Khomeni and khaomeni or even mullah Omar were not the best leaders to have . Khamenei and khomeni are in my view worst of sinners as they are responsible for endless wars and death and never opt for any peace conference with fellow Muslims .States should confine themselves to defence and law and order and promotion of Islamic cultural values , they should allow free enterprise , no direct tax , just tax at ports and sources of production . Pakistan penal code has too many punishments and our judiciary is to be replaced enmasse . What more read my threads and thanks .

 

[mrk123]

You do realize that this parade is to commemorate China's so called victory over the Japanese in second world war. You made the thread and you don't even realize that Japanese themselves have expressed regret and at times apologized over their actions and attrocities in WW2. So why would Japan care if we do or don't join in the celebration of Chinese in a war that was 70 years ago and about which the Japanese are themselves ashamed of.

Not sure where did you get this idea that it will hurt Japanese sensibilities. Its not that Pakistanis were rejoicing if there were any celebrations for dropping the atomic bombs in Japan.

How is this issue related to our religious and ummah identity is beyond me.

Yes, we should be adopt an independent foreign policy without being too dependent on any country and should chart our own course base solely on our interests.
I would say we should send a delegation to the ceremony where they commemorate the dropping of the atomic bombs in Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

Shaikh saab sometimes you over-think things :)

 

[shaikh]

You do realize that this parade is to commemorate China's so called victory over the Japanese in second world war. You made the thread and you don't even realize that Japanese themselves have expressed regret and at times apologized over their actions and attrocities in WW2. So why would Japan care if we do or don't join in the celebration of Chinese in a war that was 70 years ago and about which the Japanese are themselves ashamed of.

Not sure where did you get this idea that it will hurt Japanese sensibilities. Its not that Pakistanis were rejoicing if there were any celebrations for dropping the atomic bombs in Japan.

How is this issue related to our religious and ummah identity is beyond me.

Yes, we should be adopt an independent foreign policy without being too dependent on any country and should chart our own course base solely on our interests.
I would say we should send a delegation to the ceremony where they commemorate the dropping of the atomic bombs in Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

Shaikh saab sometimes you over-think things :)

Can you now confidently name even one country of the world about whom you are sure that will help us if india or china ever attacked us ?

 

[mrk123]

Can you now confidently name even one country of the world about whom you are sure that will help us if india or china ever attacked us ?

now you are going off on a tangent.

I was just referring to the point you raised in the first post of your thread which insinuated that by participating in a military parade commemorating China's so called victory in WW2 over Japan would have somehow miffed the Japanese.

The answer to your supposedly rhetorical question is that we SHOULD NOT depend on anyone to come save us.

I am still at a loss as to how participating in a military parade would undermine our relationship with the Japanese and how that would save us in the event of an attack.

 

[shaikh]

now you are going off on a tangent.

I was just referring to the point you raised in the first post of your thread which insinuated that by participating in a military parade commemorating China's so called victory in WW2 over Japan would have somehow miffed the Japanese.

The answer to your supposedly rhetorical question is that we SHOULD NOT depend on anyone to come save us.

I am still at a loss as to how participating in a military parade would undermine our relationship with the Japanese and how that would save us in the event of an attack.

If countries like South Korea or japan under any situation give us a few good technologies to make some expensive well selling goods we would not need china. we cannot earn billions by selling mangoes or shirts some better thing is needed .

A giant neighbour even if friendly is a cause of concern , remember that the day White man leaves gulf and the indian ocean the attitude of Chinese will become very aggressive to us.

We are not part of china japan tension. The maximum we can do is to have military presence in Hijaz for keeping holy sites open for pilgrimages and avoid conflict in a few hundred miles around it

 

[mrk123]

If countries like South Korea or japan under any situation give us a few good technologies to make some expensive well selling goods we would not need china. we cannot earn billions by selling mangoes or shirts some better thing is needed .

No one gives you technology like that. IP is makes money for these companies why would they want to hand that over to you. Anyway, what is this simplistic
thinking that if someone gives you some good technology? Why are we looking to always needing things. Lets not get the Arabs upset or the Iranians upset or the Americans upset and now its come down to don't upset the Japanese and South Koreans :)

No one is willing to hand over their IP. They make money of off it. The most you can do is to invest in education and focus on producing the manpower and offer yourselves as a cheap alternative to maufacture things for these developed countries. Something similar to what Vietnam or Cambodia etc are doing.

You strategy to grow is basically hoping that someone will drop something in your lap.

A giant neighbour even if friendly is a cause of concern , remember that the day White man leaves gulf and the indian ocean the attitude of Chinese will become very aggressive to us.

To some it may but there is not cause for concern. You shouldn't live in fear of others and what will happen far in the future. This is no way to live.

What you do is to chart your course and the way forward is to keep your eyes open, strategize based on your long term interest and be open instead of being paranoid.

We are not part of china japan tension. The maximum we can do is to have military presence in Hijaz for keeping holy sites open for pilgrimages and avoid conflict in a few hundred miles around it

Man! Shaikh Sahib you are all over the place. I forgot that this is how we started. One more time, participating in a chinese military parade isn't a big deal. Its not going to hurt japanese sensibilities and if we have not used japanese assistance in lat 60 years then the chances are we have no chance of doing it any time soon.

And, not sure where Hijaz and military came into this discussion.

Its chinese parade to commemorate their triumphover the japanese (read japanese surrender to the allies). The same war that the japanese are ashamed of and have shown regret for their part and millions of lives lost so much so that they changed to a pacifist nation. Even now the plans to amend the laws to allow their defence forces to fight abroad of the current PM are met with fierce resistance from the public.

You are making too much out of this.