Ka'inat Ki Har Shay,Ghulam e Rasool (S.a.w) Hay

[Abdul Allah]

The thread's real topic has been intentionally or unintentionally derailed or sidetracked. The post No.1 of this
thread is 'FULL OF SHIRK and LAGOO". Perhaps many will be shy to say it openly but I say it and say it
loudly and clear: The people intoxicated in the so-called "Hub-e-Rasool" cross every limit:

a) Our Prophet(PBUH) was a human being, and all human beings are the "Ghulam" of Allah(SWT).
b) No where in the Divine Book, our Prophet(PBUH) has been awarded the title "MOULA", this is
the exclusive attribute of Allah(SWT). Calling anyone "Moula" or "Moulana" is against the
quranic teaching and tantamounts to Shrik;
c) Our Prophet(pbuh), did not know what the Book is or what the "Faith"(Eeman" is, he was
instructed by Allah(SWT);

Therefore, I say it LOUD N CLEAR that Post is full of Shrik, self-invented and contrary
to Quranic principles.

you talk about Every thing being Ghulam of Allah. Agreed.
And Allah make him I repeat ALLAH MAKE HIM Rahaamat for All.
any way.
why not you start pointing all the shirk in that post one by one and explain them not just posting Quranic Ayath but with authentic explanation. do not give just link of that website.


you do not believe on Hadith? Right??

 

[babadeena]

I think you should define what Maula means
Translate word Maula from Arabic To Urdu/English with all its meanings not only one.

any i will repeat if talking about Maula as rab then only Allah is Maula.

any thing else.

I have given you the translation from whole of Quran, what is your basis of
this word "Moula", you can share it with us. Mine point of view is that
it is attribute of Allah and should not be used for any human being, if you
have different source of your base, please share it.

 

[Cheeko]

We obey to Allah and His Last Messenger peace be upon him and this way we servant. Few examples and many other examples in Quran.

These are the limits [set by] Allah , and whoever obeys Allah and His Messenger will be admitted by Him to gardens [in Paradise] under which rivers flow, abiding eternally therein; and that is the great attainment [4:13]

He who obeys the Messenger has obeyed Allah ; but those who turn away - We have not sent you over them as a guardian [4:80]

And whoever obeys Allah and His Messenger and fears Allah and is conscious of Him - it is those who are the attainers [24:52]

He will [then] amend for you your deeds and forgive you your sins. And whoever obeys Allah and His Messenger has certainly attained a great attainment [33:71]

There is not upon the blind any guilt or upon the lame any guilt or upon the ill any guilt [for remaining behind]. And whoever obeys Allah and His Messenger - He will admit him to gardens beneath which rivers flow; but whoever turns away - He will punish him with a painful punishment [48:71]

 

[Knowledge Seeker]

Use of Word "Moula" - Mufti Muneeb Ur Rehman

​

 

[Mughal1]

004.116 YUSUFALI: Allah forgiveth not (The sin of) joining other gods with Him; but He forgiveth whom He pleaseth other sins than this: one who joins other gods with Allah, Hath strayed far, far away (from the right).

004.117 YUSUFALI: (The Pagans), leaving Him, call but upon female deities: They call but upon satan the persistent rebel!

016.076 YUSUFALI: Allah sets forth (another) Parable of two men: one of them dumb, with no power of any sort; a wearisome burden is he to his master; whichever way be directs him, he brings no good: is such a man equal with one who commands Justice, and is on a Straight Way?

Allah say, he will forgive all sins short of shirk and kufar ie atheism and plytheism.

The verses in the quran like the one quoted define what shik means ie setting up gods or godesses beside Allah ie woirshipping other things as gods.

http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=4&tid=12257

(They invoke nothing but female deities besides Him (Allah),) "The idolators claimed that the angels are Allah's daughters, saying, `We only worship them so that they bring us closer to Allah.' So they took the angels as gods, made the shapes of girls and decided, `These (idols) resemble the daughters of Allah (i.e., the angels), Whom we worship. ''' This is similar to Allah's statements,


Bahot say ilfaaz aise hen jo her cheez ke liye istamaal hote hen. Yeh aik lafzi sharaakat hai haqeeqi nahin. Jese bili ko bhi YEH kehte hen aur aadami ko bhi aur pathar ko bhi. Similarly in english we call god he as well as a man. To kia insaan khudaa ban jaata hai? Kuchh qaide qanoon aise hen keh agar quran unke khilaaf hota to woh khuda ka kalaam hi nahin ho saklta tha. Quran isi liye khuda ka kalaam mana jaata hai keh us main insaani aqal ke mutaabiq achi baaten hen.

OOT PATAANG ke mutlab quran se nikallna jo saaf saaf khilaafe aqal bhi hun kahan tak drust hai?

Quran uses words MIN DOONILLAH phrase a lot and each time it can only and only means multiple gods and dodesses people ie polytheists set up as his partners in godhead and therefore call upon them in their worship like muslims call on allah.

It is common sense that when I call upon my grandson, I do not call him as my god, for goodness sake. How much more clarification one can offer on this matter I wonder?

USOOL yehi hai keh jab koi kisi ko pukarta hai to kia samajh kar pukarta hai? God, father, mother, son, daughter etc etc. Pas maloom hua keh mehz pukarna kisi ko mushriq nahin banaata balkeh dekhna pade ga kia samajh kar pukaar raha hai. Agar ghaire khuda to khuda samajh kar pukaar raha hai to mushriq thehre ga wagarna nahin.

Phir quran main allah ne khud kaha hai MUHAMMADUR RASOOLULLAH 48/29, yahan allah ka naam muhammad ka naam saath saath hen aur har masjid main pade jaata hen. Kia in ko quran se nikaal diya jaye kyunkeh yeh shirk hai?

debate between brelavies and ahlal hadith
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9vZk3oOZZ4&feature=related

 

[babadeena]

@KNOWLEDGE seeker,

I am not make quote of your post No.44, in which you scanned the excerpts of MUFTI MUNEEB UR REHMAN, not to make my post
lengthy, but I take exception of one thing first:
Mufti Muneeb, (I will respect his age, but not for the words): should have alim-courtesy to quote, when he is quoting
full verse. just picking a "fraction" from the complete verse shows that Mufti has something which he wishes to hide
or did not wish to quote, look how he not only quoted this fraction but also wrote commentary to justify that "Not only
Allah is Moula, Jabriel, Salih Momeen are also Moulas": he quoted as follows:
فَإِنَّ اللَّهَ هُوَ مَوْلَاهُ وَجِبْرِيلُ وَصَالِحُ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ ۖ

BUT THE COMPLETE AND FULL VERSE OF THE SURAH TAHRIM IS:

إِنْ تَتُوبَا إِلَى اللَّهِ فَقَدْ صَغَتْ قُلُوبُكُمَا ۖ وَإِنْ تَظَاهَرَا عَلَيْهِ فَإِنَّ اللَّهَ هُوَ مَوْلَاهُ وَجِبْرِيلُ وَصَالِحُ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ ۖ وَالْمَلَائِكَةُ بَعْدَ ذَٰلِكَ ظَهِيرٌ [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]{4**
[/FONT][SIZE=-1][Shakir 66:4] If you both turn to Allah, then indeed your hearts are already inclined (to this); and if you back up each other against him, then surely Allah it is Who is his Guardian, and Jibreel and -the believers that do good, and the angels after that are the aiders.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][Pickthal 66:4] If ye twain turn unto Allah repentant, (ye have cause to do so) for your hearts desired (the ban); and if ye aid one another against him (Muhammad) then lo! Allah, even He, is his Protecting Friend, and Gabriel and the righteous among the believers; and furthermore the angels are his helpers.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][Yusufali 66:4] If ye two turn in repentance to Him, your hearts are indeed so inclined; But if ye back up each other against him, truly Allah is his Protector, and Gabriel, and (every) righteous one among those who believe,- and furthermore, the angels - will back (him) up.

Now If I shall biopsy Moulan Muneeb's writings, then things will go very far. I have given you the complete verse
and the translation of three Translators:
It conveys that Allah is his Moula and Jabriel, Salih Momneen and Angels, After that(means Allah as Moula), are
helpers (Zaheera). Please ask Moulana, what Quran says about those people, who quote it in "divisions" or who
hide it!!!! I suppose I should not write further, because it will expose further things. Quote something else,
this has not worked.
[/SIZE]

 

[babadeena]

@Mughal1,

The verses in the quran like the one quoted define what shik means ie setting up gods or godesses beside Allah ie woirshipping other things as gods.

004.116 YUSUFALI: Allah forgiveth not (The sin of) joining other gods with Him; but He forgiveth whom He pleaseth other sins than this: one who joins other gods with Allah, Hath strayed far, far away (from the right).

إِنَّ اللَّهَ لَا يَغْفِرُ أَنْ يُشْرَكَ بِهِ وَيَغْفِرُ مَا دُونَ ذَٰلِكَ لِمَنْ يَشَاءُ ۚ وَمَنْ يُشْرِكْ بِاللَّهِ فَقَدْ ضَلَّ ضَلَالًا بَعِيدًا [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]{116**

Ask Yusuf Ali, for which arabic words he translated "other gods", the arabic word is "Yushrik" Since when, the Arabic word
"Yushrik" is "Other gods", for other Gods the arabic word is "Illah Ukhra".

[/FONT][SIZE=-1][Shakir 4:116] Surely Allah does not forgive that anything should be associated with Him, and He forgives what is besides this to whom He pleases; and whoever associates anything with Allah, he indeed strays off into a remote error.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][Pickthal 4:116] Lo! Allah pardoneth not that partners should be ascribed unto Him. He pardoneth all save that to whom He will. Whoso ascribeth partners unto Allah hath wandered far astray.
See the difference yourself. I am not advocating Shakir or Pickthal and downing Yusuf. Wrong translation whosoever,
made will be highlighted.
So my dear, now what is next. I expected from you that you should have quoted the relevant verses wherein "Other Gods" have been mentioned,
if u wish to have my help for that Most welcome. With this verse your theory is not working because the "base" is shaky in a way!!!!
[/SIZE]

 

[Mughal1]

039.053 YUSUFALI: Say: "O my Servants who have transgressed against their souls! Despair not of the Mercy of Allah: for Allah forgives all sins: for He is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

004.048 YUSUFALI: Allah forgiveth not that partners should be set up with Him; but He forgiveth anything else, to whom He pleaseth; to set up partners with Allah is to devise a sin Most heinous indeed.

These verses contradict each other unless we sort them out with help of other verses and explanations. Hence the need for context of the verses within their own place as well as within the whole of the quran. I have made this clear on my other thread.

Here allah is clearly saying he is not going to forgive shirk but in yet another verse he says he will forgive kufar and shirk if one repents. This is how the quran explains what it really means. It does not explain the whole thing in the same place rather the same thing keeps coming up with slight differences here and there, therefore shirk is also explained the same way. It is defined in one place and then simply mentioned in other places for our attention. This is why it is very wrong to stick to things verse by verse rather context is vitally imporant to get complete sense of the matter and then translate and interpret the all the related verses in that context.

004.017 YUSUFALI: Allah accept the repentance of those who do evil in ignorance and repent soon afterwards; to them will Allah turn in mercy: For Allah is full of knowledge and wisdom.

004.018 YUSUFALI: Of no effect is the repentance of those who continue to do evil, until death faces one of them, and he says, "Now have I repented indeed;" nor of those who die rejecting Faith: for them have We prepared a punishment most grievous.


071.023 YUSUFALI: "And they have said (to each other), 'Abandon not your gods: Abandon neither Wadd nor Suwa', neither Yaguth nor Ya'uq, nor Nasr';-

025.068 YUSUFALI: Those who invoke not, with Allah, any other god, nor slay such life as Allah has made sacred except for just cause, nor commit fornication; - and any that does this (not only) meets punishment.

The whole dispute the quran mentions is all about people worshipping other things as gods. The point is that shirk is always shirk and does not change with time or place or situation or circumstances.

This is why allah told angels to make sajda to aadam because allah knew that just making sajda to anyone does not make the act shirk. You see things are right and wrong objectively only. So what is wrong is wrong and what is right is therefore right. It does not matter who said it. Allah simply state the fact that shirk is believing other gods with allah. So if we do not believe other gods with allah then how can we be mushrik? I am trying to understand the logic here. It makes absolutely no sense to me whatsoever.

Angels do sajda to allah and to aadam but this in no way is shirk because to allah they make sajda as god and to aadam as a creature of allah accepting his position as the one ranked above them by allah. If the act in itself was shirk then allah would have said so? There is a big difference in definitions of word kufar and word shirk.

So polytheists are clearly believing in idols as their gods, angels as god/esses and other things as god/godesses as well and therefore they are called mushrik when they call upon their gods. Now allah has explained the shirk so he does not need to repeat the whole thing again and again because the sense is very clear indeed in every possible way.

023.091 YUSUFALI: No son did Allah beget, nor is there any god along with Him: (if there were many gods), behold, each god would have taken away what he had created, and some would have lorded it over others! Glory to Allah! (He is free) from the (sort of) things they attribute to Him!

This verse too makes very clear what is meant by shirk ie taking other things as gods along with allah. In short they are putting other things with allah in same category because they assume they too are gods or god related.

021.098 YUSUFALI: Verily ye, (unbelievers), and the (false) gods that ye worship besides Allah, are (but) fuel for Hell! to it will ye (surely) come!

021.099 YUSUFALI: If these had been gods, they would not have got there! but each one will abide therein.

037.022 YUSUFALI: "Bring ye up", it shall be said, "The wrong-doers and their wives, and the things they worshipped-

037.023 YUSUFALI: "Besides Allah, and lead them to the Way to the (Fierce) Fire!

In these verses allah leaves us in no doubt that MINDOONILLAH ARE IDOLS that polytheists worship as gods.

Here is the point, allah says that all polytheists and whatever=MINDOONILLAH they worship will end up in hell. Can anyone tells me where the prophet will end up? Of couse in the best place in the jannat. This leaves no room as to the fact that prophets are not mindoonillah at all. To be mindoonillah means feul for hell fire. In 2/23-24 allah tells that humans and stones will be feuls for hell fire. These stones are idols that mushrik worship as their gods.

If one therefore includes prophets and angels in mindoonillah list then one is saying that they too will go to hell. This cannot be belief of a sane muslim in my view. This in no way means I condone stupid acts of muslims who visit prophets grave but that is only a sin and only allah knows what is in their mind at that time or why they do such things. I wish to educate them and need help to spread the message.

As I explained already sometimes words have been clearly defined in the quran and that is why translators place the definiton in the brackets so that confusion that may arise is avoided. Now it should be clear that mindoonillah are idols that polytheist worship as gods along side allah. Jesus is worshipped but allah denies he is mindoonillah. Instead allah condemns those who worship him as their god or their god's begotten son. No muslim worships any porphet or anyone else as his god or his god's relative etc etc. So accusing any muslim of any kind of shirk is totally and utterly wrong. However, a muslim may be involved in serious sins but that is for allah to punish or forgive. But we can advise each other as brothers as to not to do stupid things.

039.064 YUSUFALI: Say: "Is it some one other than Allah that ye order me to worship, O ye ignorant ones?"

039.065 YUSUFALI: But it has already been revealed to thee,- as it was to those before thee,- "If thou wert to join (gods with Allah), truly fruitless will be thy work (in life), and thou wilt surely be in the ranks of those who lose (all spiritual good)".


Here the quran uses word GHAIRALLAH instead of mindoonillah to clarify the point further that regardless of mindoobillah=idols any other person or thing if taken to be equal or rival to god is still shirk and is wrong and will not be forgiven. Idols are also called satan or taghoot or asnaam and images etc.

021.052 YUSUFALI: Behold! he said to his father and his people, "What are these images, to which ye are (so assiduously) devoted?"

021.057 YUSUFALI: "And by Allah, I have a plan for your idols - after ye go away and turn your backs"..

021.066 YUSUFALI: (Abraham) said, "Do ye then worship, besides Allah, things that can neither be of any good to you nor do you harm?

021.067 YUSUFALI: "Fie upon you, and upon the things that ye worship besides Allah! Have ye no sense?"..

 

[6sman]

Salam,

Having a hard time trying to follow this debate since most of us are guilty of straying from the initial topic into various relative topics: issues of guardianship (ولایت), intercession (شفاعت), entreaty (استمداد), humanness (بشریت) etc, that deserve segregate and better organized discussions, are being debated altogether upon a single platform. In order to extract benefits from our dialogues we must first and foremost get our intentions correct and ask of ourselves: Are we doing this to please Allaah Ta`aala, or is our discussion merely for sake of leisure and self-promotion? Secondly, we must try and keep discussions organized in such a way that, a. it's easily understood by the general masses, and b. whereby we arrive quickly and smoothly at the desired honest conclusion. At the moment, it's all a bit haywire.

Salam!

 

[Mughal1]

Salam,

Having a hard time trying to follow this debate since most of us are guilty of straying from the initial topic into various relative topics: issues of guardianship (ولایت), intercession (شفاعت), entreaty (استمداد), humanness (بشریت) etc, that deserve segregate and better organized discussions, are being debated altogether upon a single platform. In order to extract benefits from our dialogues we must first and foremost get our intentions correct and ask of ourselves: Are we doing this to please Allaah Ta`aala, or is our discussion merely for sake of leisure and self-promotion? Secondly, we must try and keep discussions organized in such a way that, a. it's easily understood by the general masses, and b. whereby we arrive quickly and smoothly at the desired honest conclusion. At the moment, it's all a bit haywire.

Salam!

Dear 6sman, there is no confusion here all is very straight forward. Some of us here think it is ok to use certain words for allah and rasool both but some of us also think otherwise. We are trying to work out what is position of the quran in this regard.

As the discussion developed it came to rest on definiton of shirk. I have made clear the quranic definiton of shirk as far as I could and rest is all up to brothers and sister here to see what makes better to sense to them.

The point is to show point of unity wherein we all could agree and remove division thereby. This is true spirit of islam. We cannot define islam all by ourselves rather we need support of the quran because that is what islam really is ie what the quran contains and explains in its own context.

So whether we visit graves or not, seek intercession or not, seek waseela or not all becomes clear once the definiton of shirk becomes clear.

Clarifying islam as it is, is very important to remove divisions from amongst ourselves so that we have no differences on main islamic beliefs.

Anyone who does not try to understand proper islam fails to believe in proper islam properly and due to confusion ends up being led away by one's own confusion from the main stream in to sectism.

So learning and spreading evidence based knowledge of islam is necessary for all of us to some degree at least so that we are together supporting each other, not divided and fighting each other in confusion.

It was a short cut rather than filling pages after pages over each and every related issue.

Hope you understand, regards and all the best.

 

[Raaz]

قُلْ إِنَّمَا أَنَا بَشَرٌ مِثْلُكُمْ يُوحَىٰ إِلَيَّ أَنَّمَا إِلَٰهُكُمْ إِلَٰهٌ وَاحِدٌ ۖ فَمَنْ كَانَ يَرْجُو لِقَاءَ رَبِّهِ فَلْيَعْمَلْ عَمَلًا صَالِحًا وَلَا يُشْرِكْ بِعِبَادَةِ رَبِّهِ أَحَدًا
[SIZE=-1]Say: I am only a mortal like you. My Lord inspireth in me that your Allah is only One Allah. And whoever hopeth for the meeting with his Lord, let him do righteous work, and make none sharer of the worship due unto his Lord.[/SIZE]

May Allah Grant the Original writer of that paper guidance as well as
to you Mr. Noor-e-Qalb, and this Quranic Noor should really enter into
your Qalb and you may referain from making Galoo in your thoughts. All
we, including our Prophet(PBUH) is only GHULAM to Allah. and everyone
will come to our Lord as "Ghulam" and alone. Moula is the attribute of
RabulEzzat only and your post depicts contrary to Quran.

Baba Deena is like Muhamad pbuh ? ( Nauz U Billah )

Acording to muslim Statement,

اشْهَدُ انْ لّآ اِلهَ اِلَّا اللّهُ وَحْدَه لَا شَرِيْكَ لَه، وَ اَشْهَدُ اَنَّ مُحَمَّدً اعَبْدُه وَرَسُولُه
Muhammad pbuh, is slave of Allah as well as prophet. too.

The powers he exerted r related to prophethood, and most of the people like us get confused.

We never know that infact we r slave or not , no confirmation.

And thee r degrees in slave hoods too.

like some everyone is citizen , but some r in Government too.and some r in military, some are clerks , wile some r in opposition.
And he is not only Messanger but with quality of ," rahmatulil alameen"

How could we forget about Hazoor Muhammad pbuh , "We have not sent you (O Messenger), but as a mercy for all the worlds (creation)."
(Sura Al-Anbiya: 107 )
وَمَآ أَرۡسَلۡنَـٰك إِلَّا رَحۡمَةََ لِّلۡعَـٰلَمِين

 

[Raaz]

میٹھے میٹھے مدنی منّے نورِ قلب،ایسی باتیں نہیں کرتے۔ذرا بڑے ہوجاؤ،عقل آجائے(ویسے مشکل ہے)تب سوچ سمجھ کر محفل میں آنا۔ہم تو مدنی چینل پہ تمہیں دیکھ کر خوش ہوتے رہتے ہیں۔بڑی تفریح رہتی ہے۔دل بہل جاتا ہے۔​

U better watch MTV , Qadyani TV.

Your Mirza is every thing for u. with his own Angel TI- CHI TI -CHI.

 

[Raaz]

Have some quanity of sense in your head before posting. That is a Quranic verse, not mine words, which I have quoted. If you
have any reservation on Quranic Verse, just look towards Skies!!!!!!

U definitely have no comprehensive approach and u talk with very bad manners, like used to Mirza Qadyani do.

U have very scattered thoughts and have aim to fight against any Islamic thought with the irrelevant to topic Quranic verses.

Better not talk with U .

I will request all other Muslim brothers not to waste time. YOUR MISSION IS DESTRUCTION.

 

[Raaz]

@Mughal1,
Dear you have injected into thread so many topics. I just picked up from the first post only one question:

"Is it that all things of Universe are Ghulam of our Prophet(pbuh) or that of any Prophet(as)", I do not mind
discussing with you any topic which you wish, but let us please be on thread and on topic. Let us check and
decide this, that whether sayings like this is correct or it tantamounts to challenge the authority of Allah(SWT);

REGARDING YOUR POINT,
When u buy a piece of land or property u call it , I own it . But you never say , that Allah Own it. Which is the real fact.

Actually Allah has made Muhammad the best of his creation. This material is even bellow the human being.

Though it is not good to say in public that ' all things of Universe are Ghulam of our Prophet() or that of any Prophet(as),

Because some people like U get confused.

It is 100 % obvious that Kingdom is of Allah Tala, and ownership is temporarily goes to people like us.

 

[Raaz]

Right now , Everyone is going on the extreme.
Ahle Sunat wal Jamat , Sheea , Deobandi, Wahabi, ( Qadyanies r not muslim anyways).

The right path is in between of all of these. It is not a rocket science, but the fact that common sense is not very common.

People has loose temperament, and very less knowledge, with a specific feed back.

I am not a alim anyways, I am a very bigner. But only know that light of Islam will be from Rasool Allah pbuh .

Unless not connected with his institution, could not get a degree .

No matter we say Ya Rasool Allah or not. but a teacher is necessary for this study.

Thats why Allah send so may prophets, otherwise only books could be enough.

 

[Mughal1]

Baba Deena is like Muhamad pbuh ? ( Nauz U Billah )

Acording to muslim Statement,

اشْهَدُ انْ لّآ اِلهَ اِلَّا اللّهُ وَحْدَه لَا شَرِيْكَ لَه، وَ اَشْهَدُ اَنَّ مُحَمَّدً اعَبْدُه وَرَسُولُه
Muhammad pbuh, is slave of Allah as well as prophet. too.

The powers he exerted r related to prophethood, and most of the people like us get confused.

We never know that infact we r slave or not , no confirmation.

And thee r degrees in slave hoods too.

like some everyone is citizen , but some r in Government too.and some r in military, some are clerks , wile some r in opposition.
And he is not only Messanger but with quality of ," rahmatulil alameen"

How could we forget about Hazoor Muhammad pbuh , "We have not sent you (O Messenger), but as a mercy for all the worlds (creation)."
(Sura Al-Anbiya: 107 )
وَمَآ أَرۡسَلۡنَـٰك إِلَّا رَحۡمَةََ لِّلۡعَـٰلَمِين

Dear raaz, this is a brotherly discussion and no one here thinks he is like the prophet. You I think have misunderstood the stand point of babadeena. His point is only that prophets are human beings and that is waht the quran tells us.

I sense that you took babadeena's response the wrong way, please look in to it again. As a brother I would request, please avoid responding to posts that you may think deserve your anger. Ghussa aqal ko khaa jaata hai aur aadami ke monh se ghalat salat baat nikal jaati.

We are here to learn of each other and that takes time and patience. So even if some one says something that others think is wrong just help educate the person rather than take out our anger on that person, this way we will drive each other away instead of bringing each other closer, which is the main purpose of thios forum or any discussion forum.

I hope my request will be entertained and I thank you in anticipation, regards and all the best.

 

[babadeena]

U definitely have no comprehensive approach and u talk with very bad manners, like used to Mirza Qadyani do.

U have very scattered thoughts and have aim to fight against any Islamic thought with the irrelevant to topic Quranic verses.

Better not talk with U .

I will request all other Muslim brothers not to waste time. YOUR MISSION IS DESTRUCTION.

It is your choice you wish to discuss or not, but bear in mind please:
a) my almost every post contains reference from Quran;
b) the post in Question is verse from Quran, you people do not wish to accept it, or wish
to twist it or mould it according to your pre-made fiqa or creed, it is your problem, not mine.
c) Even Allah's Rasool(S) said to the people, that "Yes we are Humans like you", if you wish
I can give you that verse also.

My passion is to propogate Quran and counter with it all other "false theories". Please learn
to live with it. It is not "destruction", rather "positive construction", but unfortunately, the Quran
will be "an anguish" who do not wish to accept it.

 

[sahiL]

@Raaz.....i think u totally misunderstood this thread
u,re just reading babadeena's posts but not observing the Quranic verses
it is very informative n very important kuz ppl in pakistan r ok to call anyone "maula"......im saying many ppl not all
n most of them don,t even know the meaning of "Maula"
its good to clarify n learn keeping the "commandments of Allah(Quran) n Hadiths in sight

 

[Abdul Allah]

I have given you the translation from whole of Quran, what is your basis of
this word "Moula", you can share it with us. Mine point of view is that
it is attribute of Allah and should not be used for any human being, if you
have different source of your base, please share it.

You have given Translation of Quran not the word of Maula as whole.
You talk about post of Knowledge seeker with regards of one Ayath. (will not comment on your answer to that at this time)
But did you read with care the detail analysis of word "Maula" what is the root of that word. and what are the meaning of it in different locations.? why you stick to one LINE of that post of Knowledge Seeker?

It is simply as i said
word Maula if one is thinking as RUB than it is only for Allah
else
Maula means one who is helper.

You said it is the attribute of Allah. well the answer is in that post of Knowledge seeker.
tell me Rauf is not an attribute of Allah??
Baseer,Samee all are not attribute of Allah??
But did not you are Samee as well?? will it be a shirk if one called that your are Samee? No
Bcz Samee for Allah have GREATER and BROADER meaning but for you(and me) it have less and narrow.

please Be carefull in making your believes.

 

[Abdul Allah]

It is your choice you wish to discuss or not, but bear in mind please:
a) my almost every post contains reference from Quran;
b) the post in Question is verse from Quran, you people do not wish to accept it, or wish
to twist it or mould it according to your pre-made fiqa or creed, it is your problem, not mine.
c) Even Allah's Rasool(S) said to the people, that "Yes we are Humans like you", if you wish
I can give you that verse also.

My passion is to propogate Quran and counter with it all other "false theories". Please learn
to live with it. It is not "destruction", rather "positive construction", but unfortunately, the Quran
will be "an anguish" who do not wish to accept it.

They are Bashar like us

But are we Bashare like them

that is the question dear.