Is it possible to create a state on the model of state of Madinah?

[Mughal1]

Okay, got it. It also means that this was a hollow Slogan ? Is that right or not ?

No, it is not a hollow slogan. It is because the final messenger of God brought about a state on the basis of the quran.

Empty slogan is that which cannot be realised ie turned into a reality or is not intended to be turned into a reality.

 

[OneManArmy]

No, it is not a hollow slogan. It is because the final messenger of God brought about a state on the basis of the quran.

Empty slogan is that which cannot be realised ie turned into a reality or is not intended to be turned into a reality.

May be you didn't get what I said. It is true that our Prophet (PBUH) showed to the world how the state can exist within the domain of Islamic laws. However., What was done on the name of that state in Pakistan in Last election was just a hollow slogan and there was no spirit behind it, neither any home work was done.

 

[Mughal1]

May be you didn't get what I said. It is true that our Prophet (PBUH) showed to the world how the state can exist within the domain of Islamic laws. However., What was done on the name of that state in Pakistan in Last election was just a hollow slogan and there was no spirit behind it, neither any home work was done.

No, pakistan was doomed from the very day it was created. Why? Because it was created for displaying proper islamic system of governance before the world. This is why a slogan was raised, pakistan ka matlab kia? People who floated the idea were barristers yet they failed to prepare a proper constitution for it. Why? Because islam they talked about was not the islam that was made known to muslims by their mullaans.

So pakistanies were a divided nations on various grounds right from the start and nothing was done to undo these divisions instead they were hyped up. So pakistan is doomed if it does not have army and it is doomed if it does have it. Unless proper islam is made known to masses for their unity, peace, progress and prosperity as a people. This cannot be done without proper scholarship of proper islam.

 

[OneManArmy]

No, pakistan was doomed from the very day it was created. Why? Because it was created for displaying proper islamic system of governance before the world. This is why a slogan was raised, pakistan ka matlab kia? People who floated the idea were barristers yet they failed to prepare a proper constitution for it. Why? Because islam they talked about was not the islam that was made known to muslims by their mullaans.

So pakistanies were a divided nations on various grounds right from the start and nothing was done to undo these divisions instead they were hyped up. So pakistan is doomed if it does not have army and it is doomed if it does have it. Unless proper islam is made known to masses for their unity, peace, progress and prosperity as a people. This cannot be done without proper scholarship of proper islam.

Look, before our prophet ( PBUH) ,the Arabs were also divided among tribes. Islam suppose to bring them back in to the fold .
My point is that we are 75 years from the inception and you are still blaming them for their collective wisdom .
What was needed and never did happen was a ground building where a new nation could
fulfill their dreams . It required work on the ground to prepare for their Journey . Our beloved prophet didn't merely sermon them but work hard on the ground to build their character. Did any of the so called leaders ever try to do that in Pakistan ? No.

 

[Mughal1]

Look, before our prophet ( PBUH) ,the Arabs were also divided among tribes. Islam suppose to bring them back in to the fold .
My point is that we are 75 years from the inception and you are still blaming them for their collective wisdom .
What was needed and never did happen was a ground building where a new nation could
fulfill their dreams . It required work on the ground to prepare for their Journey . Our beloved prophet didn't merely sermon them but work hard on the ground to build their character. Did any of the so called leaders ever try to do that in Pakistan ? No.

You are telling me what I stated already. You can read it again.

So pakistanies were a divided nations on various grounds right from the start and nothing was done to undo these divisions instead they were hyped up. So pakistan is doomed if it does not have army and it is doomed if it does have it. Unless proper islam is made known to masses for their unity, peace, progress and prosperity as a people. This cannot be done without proper scholarship of proper islam.

 

[OneManArmy]

You are telling me what I stated already. You can read it again.

So pakistanies were a divided nations on various grounds right from the start and nothing was done to undo these divisions instead they were hyped up. So pakistan is doomed if it does not have army and it is doomed if it does have it. Unless proper islam is made known to masses for their unity, peace, progress and prosperity as a people. This cannot be done without proper scholarship of proper islam.

What I am most interested is in your views about the PTI and its strategy and use of slogan of RM. . Was it hollow slogan which was given just to get the votes or not ?

 

[Mughal1]

What I am most interested is in your views about the PTI and its strategy and use of slogan of RM. . Was it hollow slogan which was given just to get the votes or not ?

But dear onemanarmy I have nothing to do with pti or any other religious or political party.

I am all for riyaasate madinah and I am working on the project. This should be very much obvious from my posts if you read them.

Main things is I do not accept islam is a religion or a dogmatic belief system or a creed. To me it is a complete code for humanity for living their life in this world properly. It tells us how to live in this world properly so that we do not end up fighting with each other. It is a peace plan from God for humanity. If people who are fighting with each other over various things will accept this peace plan by doing what it demands of people and by not doing what it stops them from then they will have no problems in living a great life in this world with help and full support of each other for which Allah will reward them in hereafter as well.

 

[OneManArmy]

But dear onemanarmy I have nothing to do with pti or any other religious or political party.

I am all for riyaasate madinah and I am working on the project. This should be very much obvious from my posts if you read them.

Main things is I do not accept islam is a religion or a dogmatic belief system or a creed. To me it is a complete code for humanity for living their life in this world properly. It tells us how to live in this world properly so that we do not end up fighting with each other. It is a peace plan from God for humanity. If people who are fighting with each other over various things will accept this peace plan by doing what it demands of people and by not doing what it stops them from then they will have no problems in living a great life in this world with help and full support of each other for which Allah will reward them in hereafter as well.

All right, Now tell me one thing . Would you have accepted the fact that Mr. Khan is trying to reconstitue the RM and could have helped him ?

 

[Mughal1]

All right, Now tell me one thing . Would you have accepted the fact that Mr. Khan is trying to reconstitue the RM and could have helped him ?

Yes, I will help anyone who will work for the establishment of the state on the model of the state of madinah. There is no other way humanity can live in peace with each other and prosper otherwise. This is why there is no peace in the human world all over the globe because people are divided on various grounds.

 

[OneManArmy]

Yes, I will help anyone who will work for the establishment of the state on the model of the state of madinah. There is no other way humanity can live in peace with each other and prosper otherwise. This is why there is no peace in the human world all over the globe because people are divided on various grounds.

Well, I guess than you are no better than a common person who could be fooled with the name of RM and fall for it.
Remember, you said earlier that the homework needed to be done before announcing such slogans to the public. Its not a switch on the wall to turn on and off anytime you like.

 

[Mughal1]

Well, I guess than you are no better than a common person who could be fooled with the name of RM and fall for it.
Remember, you said earlier that the homework needed to be done before announcing such slogans to the public. Its not a switch on the wall to turn on and off anytime you like.

Are you a muslim?

 

[OneManArmy]

Are you a muslim?

AlhumduLillah

What it got to do with my question ? Fall for the slogan by Fake people ?

 

[Wake up Pak]

People who claim to be muslims some of them talk about creating a state on the model of state of madinah that was brought about by the final messenger of Allah.
The question is, is it possible to do that? The idea of creating a state on the model of state of madinah gives rise to many questions eg what do we really know about the state of madinah? Why was it created? How was it brought about? How was it maintained? Unless people who want to create a state based upon model of madinah state can clearly answer these like questions, there is no chance for them to bring about a state like that. The main question is, where did the model come from for the state of madinah? Is it even possible to create a state based upon model of madinah state in any muslim state?

So all those who claim to be muslims are welcome to participate in this discussion. It is because if muslims have no idea about islam as to what it actually is then how can they even think about bringing about a state based upon model of state of madinah?

To answer your questions, yes It is possible to create the State on the model of Medina solely by implementing and following the Quran.
Regrettably, Muslims have abandoned the Quran and blindly followed the religion of our ancestors and mullahs.
What do you say atensari

 

[Mughal1]

AlhumduLillah

What it got to do with my question ? Fall for the slogan by Fake people ?

Since you claim to have your own views, could you kindly refer me to your own work on the quranic text? That will be a good starting point.

Also can you please let me know the steps required for bringing about a state based upon the model of madinah state. Thanks

 

[OneManArmy]

Since you claim to have your own views, could you kindly refer me to your own work on the quranic text? That will be a good starting point.

Also can you please let me know the steps required for bringing about a state based upon the model of madinah state. Thanks

I will love to debate with you How easy you can be swayed away by pronouncing a slogan without the ground work done . The life of our prophet (PBUH) showed itself how the goal of converting a tribal society in to a vibrant ,progressive Islamic nation was done .

It is not mine or your way of doing it.
My whole point of this discussion is not circulating around how to find a magic formula and convert this nation of idiots and impractical population in to a devoted Islamic state by just shouting a slogan overnight and collect votes and become PM .
I had specific questions regarding your post and i asked you those questions . Sorry but instead of answering it straight forward , you been beating the bushes around and start asking me the solutions.

 

[Bull]

Madina key riasat tu tub bany na jab riasat kay malik chahingay.

 

[Mughal1]

I will love to debate with you How easy you can be swayed away by pronouncing a slogan without the ground work done . The life of our prophet (PBUH) showed itself how the goal of converting a tribal society in to a vibrant ,progressive Islamic nation was done .

It is not mine or your way of doing it.
My whole point of this discussion is not circulating around how to find a magic formula and convert this nation of idiots and impractical population in to a devoted Islamic state by just shouting a slogan overnight and collect votes and become PM .
I had specific questions regarding your post and i asked you those questions . Sorry but instead of answering it straight forward , you been beating the bushes around and start asking me the solutions.

Dear onemanarmy, that is why I want to know what you have in your mind so that then I could agree or disagree with your goal and approach. Slogans and flags have their own importance in minds of people regardless you and I like it or not.

Goal comes first before anyone could make a move towards it. What should that goal be and why is also open to discussion.

Once we have a goal then we need a way to get there. How do we find the way needed to get there? So you can see things are not as simple as they may look to us.

The basic point is we need to make a start from somewhere. Little by little then we can adjust and readjust things for fine tuning. By criticising each other for wrong reasons we will never be able to make a move at all. This is why anyone who does something that looks to us right we should therefore support it, the while we continue opposing all that is thought and done wrong in our own view.

I see nothing wrong with slogan of riyaasate madinah. If imran khan takes steps to move us closer to this target then so be it. I will support even mullaans in whatever they do which moves us closer to this target the while I will continue opposing them in what they do wrong in my view.

It is not supporting those people but supporting what is right and opposing what is wrong.

If you will do something similar you will also have my support or opposition. All or nothing at all does not work in this human world of which we all are a part. Even the quran was not revealed by God for mankind all in one go. Even the state of madinah was not brought about in one day.

This is why we need to make sense of things as to how they should be done in light of how they can be done.

Just as I am working on this project so I assume you will be working on this project. I have explained my project in my posts here on this forum and you can explain your way of doing things so that people who want to work for this project could choose any way that suits them better.

In my view, we are nowhere without knowing the message in the quran properly. Once the quranic message makes proper sense to us then we can act upon it faithfully.

There is no rational interpretation of the quran in the muslim world to start with. This is why I am working on this project. Mullaans interpretations of the quran have rendered it utterly senseless due to their irrational approach to this project. Rest of muslims are following the quranic message blindly as it is understood by mullaans.

So I will suggest you share your work on the quran and islam for the benefit of humanity. Let people decide what they choose for themselves.

 

[Munawarkhan]

It’s not that difficult, everything is documented.

Why should we keep a target as China or Denmark. When we have an example of a state which was strong, just and people were happier.

People who claim to be muslims some of them talk about creating a state on the model of state of madinah that was brought about by the final messenger of Allah.
The question is, is it possible to do that? The idea of creating a state on the model of state of madinah gives rise to many questions eg what do we really know about the state of madinah? Why was it created? How was it brought about? How was it maintained? Unless people who want to create a state based upon model of madinah state can clearly answer these like questions, there is no chance for them to bring about a state like that. The main question is, where did the model come from for the state of madinah? Is it even possible to create a state based upon model of madinah state in any muslim state?

So all those who claim to be muslims are welcome to participate in this discussion. It is because if muslims have no idea about islam as to what it actually is then how can they even think about bringing about a state based upon model of state of madinah?

 

[Mughal1]

Before a people could bring about a state like the state of madinah as it has been exemplified by the last and the final prophet and messenger of Allah and his companions one has to know some basics.

1)What is a project? Define it in a few words if you have any idea about it at all.

2)What is a process?Define it in a few words if you have any idea about it at all.

3)What is a mechanism? Define it in a few words if you have any idea about it at all.

4)What is relationship between these terms or how are these words related to each other. Explain this the best you can.




1)What is meaning of word ideology?

2)What is meaning of word society?

3)What is meaning of word politics?

4)What is meanings of word culture?

5)What is meaning of word economy?

6)What is relationship between these terms or how are these words related to each other. Explain this the best you can.




1)What is meaning of word system?

2)What is meaning of word structure?

3)What is meaning of word procedure?

4)What is meaning of word practice?

5) What is relationship between these terms or how are these words related to each other. Explain this the best you can.

Finally how all of these words are interlinked or related to each other, can anyone explain this in a bit of detail which makes sense?

 

[Mughal1]

What is a project?

It is anything anyone needs or wants to do or is told to do. However it involves intention, objective or end product, planning and completion. So it becomes a process from start or beginning to end or finish or completion. The initiated project completes when the end product or objective is achieved or accomplished. It involves mechanisms which are used to get end result or outcome.

So anything done without any intention or objective or end result or outcome or end product in mind is a useless or aimless or purposeless exercise.

The question is, is islam truly a project or mission assigned for mankind by God to carry out or are people just wasting their time by doing aimless random things and assuming they have done their bit so they will be alright in here as well as in hereafter?

The truth is, islam is a mission given to mankind through his book by God to accomplish. It is a purpose based proper program for mankind from God with goals for mankind to accomplish according to his provided purpose based proper guidelines. So unless and until they accomplish this mission or complete this project things will remain as they are no matter what people think and do instead of what they are supposed to be thinking and doing. It will only and only keep on harming and destroying them by hands of each other.

So one can see how projects, processes and mechanisms are interconnected.