What is shirk (شرک کیا ہے) ??

[babadeena]

وَمَا ظَلَمْنَاهُمْ وَلَٰكِنْ ظَلَمُوا أَنْفُسَهُمْ ۖ فَمَا أَغْنَتْ عَنْهُمْ آلِهَتُهُمُ الَّتِي يَدْعُونَ مِنْ دُونِ اللَّهِ مِنْ شَيْءٍ لَمَّا جَاءَ أَمْرُ رَبِّكَ ۖ وَمَا زَادُوهُمْ غَيْرَ تَتْبِيبٍ [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]{101**[/FONT]
[SIZE=-1][Shakir 11:101] And We did not do them injustice, but they were unjust to themselves, so their gods whom they called upon besides Allah did not avail them aught when the decree of your Lord came to pass; and they added but to their ruin.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][Pickthal 11:101] We wronged them not, but they did wrong themselves; and their gods on whom they call beside Allah availed them naught when came thy Lord's command; they added to them naught save ruin.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][Yusufali 11:101] It was not We that wronged them: They wronged their own souls: the deities, other than Allah, whom they invoked, profited them no whit when there issued the decree of thy Lord: Nor did they add aught (to their lot) but perdition!

This is answer to your query that people took them as "GOD", Attention to words "Illaha" in the verse. I can given
you more verses, where people were taking them as "GOD" it was mentioned clearly. I have more verses in this regard
where Allah specifically categorized those unto whom they cried/worshiped as "GODS".

Now I will wait reply from you before I further proceed. thanks
[/SIZE]

 

[Mughal1]

Dear brother thank you for responding but I was busy editing my post to includes a couple of more points that came to my mind to clarify things a bit more for you.

Regardless situation remains the same that mindoonillah are idols that mushrik worship as far as allah is concerned. Allah excludes godly people.

Thanks for bringing in the list the sun as well but that is saying of hudhuda not allah. Even If I accept that it makes no diffeernc eto my stance. That is because my styance is that allah will thrown in hell nmindoonollah buit not his own worshippers just because some people say they are their gods. Also those people who claim they are gods do not claim to be muslims and allah does not call them mushrik but kaafir.

regards.


SURAH 12 Yusuf

Proclaim in the name of Allah the gracious the merciful

1) Alif Laam Raa. These are evidences of the uniquely distinct constitution.

2) We have revealed it as a proclamation in a uniquely distinct language in a uniquely distinct structure so that you the mankind could learn reasoning to become a rational people.

3) So let Us furnish you the mankind by means of this Quran with a purposeful information to abide by because when you act without it you will act like ignorant people.

4) Call to mind the time when Joseph said to father of his nation, O father! I see bright future in unity of people as a community therefore I would like to see the leadership and the following accept my vision for their better future.

5) He replied, O son of my nation! Disclose not this dream of yours to your fellow community members just as yet in case they scheme a plot against you and catch you unprepared because the opposition based upon harmful and destructive mindset and attitude is an open enemy of humanity.

6) Rest assured it will happen as you imagined because you will be chosen by your Lord for His mission so He will teach you how to diagnose problems properly relating individuals and communities and find their proper solutions that is how He will fulfil His mission through you and the ideological children of Jacob as He fulfilled it through your ideological forefathers Abraham and Isaac before you. That is how your Lord makes obvious for mankind that He rules through wisdom.

7) Indeed in the account of Joseph and his brethren there are lessons for would be leaders and supporters as to how they should or should not conduct themselves in relation to fulfilment of their needs and desires as a people.

8) His community fellows who stood against his vision for society said to each other, see Joseph and his supporters they are loved and respected more by our community leadership than us even though we are a group of powerful people of this society. Our leadership is obviously wrong in not considering us for the leadership of our community.

9) Some said to others, in order to throw Joseph out of community leadership contest let us fight Joseph thereby force him out of this place to some far-off land so that the attention of leadership of your people focuses upon you alone as proper candidates for leadership of the community because only after doing that you can be of those who reach their ambition.

10) At this one of them said, you cannot fight Joseph but if you must do something instead get hold of him quietly and throw him into some dungeon till he could be picked up by some bandits so that he is out of our way.

11) So they ask their chief administrator, O chief of our nation! Why do you not appoint us as security guards over Joseph instead of those already responsible for it because we surely are his sincere well-wishers?

12) Pass on his security responsibility to us for future so that he could move about for taking care of his business without worrying about his security. We will indeed take good care of him.

13) He said to them, I will be anxious if you accompanied him because I am concerned in case some bandit attacks him the while you are caught unprepared off your guard.

14) They said, if a bandit could attack him despite our number and strength then surely we would be a worthless people.

15) That is how they were able to take him away because they plotted to place him into a dungeon. However We revealed this to Joseph that a time will come when you will remind them about this act of theirs but just now they do not perceive the consequences of what they are doing.

16) At the end of the period of their responsibility for security of Joseph they returned to their chief crying in tears.

17) They said, O our chief, we went on our individual business ahead of each other leaving Joseph behind to look after our things and at length the bandit attacked and made off with him. It is not that you are going to be satisfied with our this action but we are telling the truth.

18) That is how through animosity they brought about denial of his right to succession of community leadership. He said, no I am not satisfied with your explanation rather people involved in your group have made you to cook up a tale regarding this matter. However steadfast persistence is needed for reaching the truth about this matter, so universal law of Allah should be relied upon regarding that which you assert.

19) At length a party of bandits came by and they sent one of them to carry out the deal so he laid down his weaponry and came to see the merchant. After seeing the young man he said, O goodness! What a young man and took him to his group. Even though they kept him in hiding like a great treasure yet Allah makes obvious what they did.

20) His brethren sold him cheap in a hurry for a petty price of a few Dirhams to bandits, for that is what he was worth in their sight.

21) The Egyptian who bought Joseph from the bandits and freed him said to his community, treat him honourably as if he is one of us, he could prove very beneficial for us or we can adopt him as a son of our nation. That is how We established Joseph in that piece of land and taught him the sense of handling all the affairs that need proper handling in a country. Allah has set laws to govern all affairs though most of the people learn not to realise it.

22) When he reached maturity We had already bestowed on him ability of gathering information about things and ways of making sense of all that. That is how We reward those who work hard for the good of the mankind.

23) However the ruling elite and priestly class of the community under whose jurisdiction he was decided to try and change his way of doing things by closing all the ways of doing things to him saying, come join our way of doing things. He replied, I seek protection in universal laws of Allah Lord of mine Who has entrusted me with responsibility of this good land to manage things therein properly. Surely those who transgress His set limits therefore prosper not.

24) Yet party of ruling and priestly classes went ahead in order to try and change his mind and he too would have inclined towards its way of doing things had he not been shown by his Lord the results of their course of actions. That is how We shielded him from doing anything whereby he could harm and destroy others and bring gloom and doom upon himself therefore he remained true follower of Our guidance.

25) As each of the parties tried to outdo the other its own way the opposite party was involved in foul play right from the start because it attacked his person instead of his vision in order to shatter his personality. That is how the opponent party landed both the parties at the court of the chief of the community saying to him, what punishment does someone who intended harm and destruction against your community deserve other than imprisonment or a painful chastisement?

26) Joseph said, it was this party of rulers and priests that tried to move me away from my way of doing things and a group of people of this community was present at this event and saw all this. The community chief said that if his vision was attacked the right way then party of rulers and priests is telling the truth and he is lying

27) but if it was attacked the wrong way then he is speaking the truth and the party of rulers and priests is lying.

28) So when community chief examined the statements of the witnesses and came to conclusion that he was attacked the wrong way in order that his personality is destroyed he said to party of rulers and priests, it is one of the tricks of you the party of rulers and priests. Your conspiracy was mighty indeed!

29) He said, O Joseph, ignore their way of doing things and O party of rulers and priests, seek correction of the way you do things because you were indeed the ones who did the things wrong way.

30) However the word spread among communities of the township that party of ruling elite and priestly class under the governor of Egypt has conspired to change the way of doing things of its civil servant because the rest of the community has fallen madly in love with him the way he does things for it. In fact, we see it totally lost in his love.

31) At length when the embarrassing remarks became unbearable for party of ruling elite and priestly class, it invited them and prepared for them a banquet and gave each of them an opportunity to scrutinise his way of doing things. As they engaged in cross examination of his way of doing things, the party called on Joseph to come out to face them. When they examined him they were so amazed that they ended up shooting themselves in the foot so they exclaimed spontaneously, good Lord! He looks nothing like an ordinary person rather he looks like a highly ranked knowledgeable official of a noble descent.

32) The party of ruling elite and priestly class said, this is he about whom you blamed me. No doubt I conspired to change him but he escaped my set out trap for him. If he does not do things the way I say, he should be thrown into prison indeed to be disgraced.

33) Joseph said, O my Lord! I rather go to prison than do things the way they demand of me but unless You inspire me with some way out of their cunning trap for me I may end up trapped among them and forced to become of those who live not by your guidance.

34) That is how his Lord inspired him with proper response warding off their cunning trap from him and that is how He makes obvious for mankind that He is indeed comprehensive in observation of all things.

35) But even after all the evidence they had seen they still decided to send him to prison for a time.

36) Two young men were also in the prison with him. One day they discussed with each other their individual ambitions so one of them said, I had a dream that in time I will become source of knowledge for the people. The other said, I had a dream of taking on responsibility of livelihood for people in which partake people who prove to be excellent in this kind of work. Tell us how can we have such outcomes for our these ambitions, we ask you about it because we see that you are a man who directs others for the good of each other.

37) Joseph replied, I will explain to you how you should go about fulfilling your dreams before you start working on them to get the outcomes you desire because this is part of the knowledge about making sense of things which my Lord has taught me. In fact, I have nothing to do with rule of people who do not commit to working for peace and prosperity of mankind according to guidance of Allah because they deny people the right to fruit of their hard work in the end.

38) So I follow the guidance of Allah and guide others to do the same just like my forefathers Abraham and Isaac and Jacob. It is not fitting that we take any sovereigns other than Allah. This is our task/mission set by Allah for the good of the mankind yet most of the people do not become a people worth the name.

39) O my fellow inmates! Tell me, what is better, many different sovereigns or just one sovereign, Allah, the Irresistible?

40) Those you serve other than Him as rulers are nothing but mere names which you and your forefathers have invented, for which Allah has revealed no proof. Surely sovereignty belongs to none but Allah Who has ordained that you serve none as ruler save Him. That is the way of doing things which is proper yet most of the people do not learn to understand it.

41) As to your dreams O my inmates! Each of you will be released soon from the prison and one of you will serve wine of knowledge to your king and the other will be placed firmly on state affairs of which people will have their provisions. That is how your dreams will become realities regarding which you asked for directions.

42) Then to the one who he thought will advise his king said, mention me to your lord. But the lack of attention made him forget to mention Joseph to his king, so he remained in the prison a few more years.

43) Then one day the king of Egypt said to his counsel, I see a number of big splits in my people in which are involved many weak members of our society but I also see a number of long periods of stability and prosperity as well as number of periods of instability and exploitation and hardship. O chiefs! Explain to me how can I reach my desired outcome if you can analyse the situation and the circumstances and plan ahead in order to guide me.

44) They replied, these are depressing thoughts and we are not skilled in dealing with situations like this.

45) Thereupon one of the two released prisoners remembered after a long time and spoke up, I will tell you how to handle this situation just send me to Joseph.

46) So he came and said, O Joseph my truly well wishing friend! Explain to us how to handle the situation wherein are involved a number of big splits in people in which are involved many weak members of society and also wherein are possible a number of long periods of stability and prosperity as well as number of periods of instability and exploitation and hardship, so that I return to the people who sent me and let them know the solution to their problems.

47) He replied, you should actively cultivate good relations among all people in the land for a number of years till it becomes a normal way of life then whatever good relationship you manage to develop maintain it in its good state though you will participate in this program just a little.

48) However your failure to reach the target after this advice could bring upon you a number of years of hardship and troubles that will render useless whatever steps you would have taken already save a little which you may have specifically paid attention to.

49) But if you managed to repair and maintain your society after that will come a period of abundant prosperity during which the people will benefit greatly.

50) However instead of following the program as told by Joseph the king said, bring this man to me. When the messenger came Joseph said to him, go back to your king and ask him about the case of those communities that lost their case due to loss of their ability to produce worthy argument. Indeed my Lord has exposed their plot for people to see for what it was.

51) The king called them in to his court and questioned them saying, what do you say about the incident when you attempted to wrong foot Joseph? They replied, Allah forbid! We know of no harmful motive on his part against our community. The party of ruling elite and priestly class that was under governor of Egypt said, now that the truth has come to light, it was I who attempted to wrong foot him against his way of doing things. The fact is, he is absolutely trustable.

52) Joseph said, by this inquiry I meant to let the governor of Egypt know that I did not betray him in his absence regarding the responsibility he assigned to me and that Allah does not let the plots of the treacherous succeed for long.

53) This I did, not because I am free of human needs and desires but to prove that human needs and desires prompt one to do harm to others unless one follows program of my Lord for peace and prosperity of mankind and that is how program of my Lord protects humanity against harm and destruction.

54) The king said, bring him to me so that I appoint him to assist me in taking care of affairs of the kingdom. When Joseph was brought to the king and they had mutual talk the king said, from now on you have an honourable place among us and you will enjoy our full confidence.

55) Seeing the situation that kingdom was going to be destroyed through disintegration by civil wars if right steps were not taken Joseph requested the king, let me deal with the people and resources of the land. Certainly I know how to manage things to avoid what is otherwise inevitable and rest assured I have all the knowledge needed for the task ahead.

56) Thus We established Joseph in the land to live therein in any way he wished within Our set limits. We bestow understanding of Our program for peace and prosperity upon whoever works for it because We do not let the reward of people who do good for each other go to waste.

57) Yet the reward in the hereafter will be even better for those who commit to working for peace and are consistent with Our constitution for the good of mankind.

58) After a period of time there came brethren of Joseph to Egypt looking for food to buy so they entered his office. He recognized them but they recognized him not.

59) When he had given them their due provisions he said, come again to me with other bother of yours with permission from father of your nation. Do you not see that I give full measure and provide the best hospitality?

60) But if do not come to me with him then you will have no grain, nor will you be allowed to approach me.

61) They replied, we will certainly try our best to get him from his father. This we will surely do.

62) Joseph told his officials to put their money into their saddlebags such that they should come to know about it only when they reach their people so that they lack not money to come back.

63) When they returned to father of their nation they said, Father! Grain is henceforth denied to us unless we take with us our brother therefore send our brother with us so that we may get our measure, we will take full responsibility for his safety and security.

64) He said, should I trust you for his security as I once trusted you for security of his brother? However laws of Allah are unique when it comes to security of mankind because He is provider of the program that ensures peace and prosperity of humanity.

65) However at length when they opened their baggage they discovered that their money had been returned to them by the king out of generosity. Father! They cried with joy, what more can we ask for? Here is our money given back to us. So we can buy more food for our people and we will take good care of our brother if you let him go with us because we can get an extra caravan load of grain.

66) Jacob replied, I will never send him with you unless you swear in the name of Allah under oath that you will surely bring him back to me unless you are overcome by some other situation rendering you helpless. After they had sworn under oath he said, Allah is our witness over this pledge you made.

67) Then he said, my children! Do not enter the capital of Egypt all together at once through one gate that they take you wrongly instead enter from the different gates and separately. Not that I can avail you aught against laws of Allah but that be cautious because none can judge things for what they are free of error save Allah. In His laws I put my trust and in His law let all those who need someone to put their rust in should put their trust.

68) When they entered the city as their father had advised them it worked for them but it did not cover them fully like the plan of Allah for them that was to unfold. Of course, Jacob did his best to address the concern he had in his mind, after all he possessed the knowledge which We had given him even though most of the people do not bother to learn to be sensible.

69) When they entered upon Joseph, he called his brother alone to himself and said, it is I your brother Joseph, so grieve not at what they have been doing to us and our people.

70) At length when Joseph had finished arranging the loading of their provisions, he gave a party in honour of his brother. Later on when they were on a journey back home a crier called out to them saying, O people of the caravan! You must be thieves.

71) They turned back and asked, what have you lost?

72) The officials said, we have lost the grain measuring tool of the king and the one who brings it back will be awarded a camel-load of corn, I guarantee it.

73) Joseph’s brethren said, by Allah! You should know by our behaviour during our stay here that we did not come here to cause trouble in your land and we are no thieves.

74) The official said, what should be the punishment for the thief if you prove to be the liars?

75) They replied, the reward for him in whose pack you find the royal grain measuring instrument will be that he should compensate you for what he did to you, that is how we punish those who do wrong.

76) After this Joseph first began to search the packs of others before the pack of his brother. Finally he took it out of his brother’s pack. Thus We directed Joseph under Our law for Israel, for He could not hold back his brother under the law of the king but Allah planned otherwise. We exalt in ranks whoever works according to Our set out laws because above all the learned is the One Who makes information obvious for them.

77) After accusation of theft the brethren of Joseph remarked, This is no surprise if he has committed a theft because his brother also committed a theft before him. Despite hearing this Joseph suppressed his feelings and did not reveal anything to them but said to himself, what a terrible situation you people are putting yourselves in and Allah will make obvious the truth about that about which you accuse me.

78) They said, O noble governor! The father of the accused is a great leader of the nation who may not take this lightly, so take one of us instead of him. We surely see that you are one of those who do good for others.

79) Joseph replied, I seek protection through law of Allah therefore far from me be that we seize other than the one with whom we found our property or we will be unjust indeed.

80) When they lost their hope of moving Joseph, they went aside to confer in private. The leading one among them said to rest, you know that your father had taken a solemn pledge in the name of Allah and you also know how you fell short of your duty to Allah with respect to Joseph therefore I am not going to leave this land until the father of our nation permits me or Allah decides for me the matter some other way because He is unique of all those who claim to be the rulers.

81) So go back to father of your nation without me and say, father, your son has committed theft. We did not see him stealing but we can testify only to what we know. How could we guard against this unforeseen situation?

82) You may enquire from the people of the city where we lodged and the caravan in which we travelled that we are indeed telling the truth.

83) When Jacob is told this he said, no! You yourselves have contrived a story once more. However I will remain steadfastly persistent in pursuing this case. May be thereby Allah will bring them all back to me because He makes his wisdom known to mankind through His rule.

84) He turned his face away from them crying, Alas for Joseph! His eyes became used to grief and he became overwhelmed by sorrow.

85) They said, by Allah! you will not cease to remember Joseph until you ruin your health or kill yourself by this grief.

86) He said, I complain of my distress and grief to Allah Alone and I know from Allah what you know not.

87) O my children! Go and search for Joseph and his brother. Never give up hope in mercy of Allah, in fact none despairs of mercy of Allah except people who fail to put their trust in His guidance.

88) When they went back to Egypt and entered the office of Joseph they said, O noble governor! We and our people are in distress because we are running short on money so please give us full quota and also more out of your own generosity. Surely Allah rewards those who help others.

89) Hearing this he said, do you know what you did to Joseph and his brother while acting out of ignorance

90) In surprise they cried, what! Are you really Joseph? He said, Yes! I am Joseph and this is my brother. Allah has indeed been gracious to us all. In fact he who is consistent with laws of Allah for the good of humanity Allah does not let the reward of such good people go to waste.

91) They said, by Allah! surely we can now see why Allah has chosen you instead of us. We have indeed been guilty of side stepping His guidance.

92) Joseph said, there is no blame on you today. May Allah protect you all! He is unique of those who claim to be merciful!

93) Go take the news of my khilaafah and cast it before my father, he will rediscover his happy sight. Thereafter come back to me with all the members of your community.

94) When the caravan started from Egypt the father of their nation in Canaan said, Certainly I feel the presence of power of Joseph even though you the people around me may think I am out of my mind.

95) They said, by Allah! You are still suffering from your old illusion.

96) However when the bearer of the good news arrived, he cast the news of his khilaafah before him so he regained his happy sight then he said, did I not tell you that I know due to understanding of set laws of Allah what you do not learn to understand things?

97) They said, Father! Bring about harm and destruction free community for our future because we have inflicted harm and destruction upon each other in the past and suffered because of that.

98) He replied, soon I will bring about a harm and destruction free community for you as advised by my Lord, surely He protects mankind through His program for blissful life for them.

99) After a while when they came to Joseph he asked leaders and supporters of his community to become his protectorates and said, now that you have come to Egypt if program of Allah is implemented fully and remains enforced then you will find yourselves at peace in here.

100) That is how he raised the managers of his community and the managed to heights of dignified life because they all accepted his proposal so he said, O father of my nation, this is the fulfilment of my vision that I had long ago, because my following of law of my Lord has turned it into a reality. It was goodness of His mission indeed as planned by Him that He brought me out of prison to put me to work whereby He brought you all here from the unproductive land even though the opposers had stirred up strife between me and my community brethren. For sure my Lord fulfils His plan subtly in mysterious ways. Surely He makes His wisdom obvious for mankind to learn from to make sense of thing.

101) O Lord! You have indeed given me the kingdom and taught me all the knowhow about all the affairs of the kingdom. The originator of the heavens and the earth, Your law has been my protector from the beginning of my life and it will remain my protector in the life to come, so fulfil me completely so long as I remain committed to your law.

102) O Muhammad, even though this account which We have revealed to you is a collection about the past events when you the people were not there with brethren of Joseph who together conspired and schemed against him

103) but they are revealed for you so that you too strive as he did in the face of adversity because most people are not going to commit to working for peace otherwise.

104) This is why you should not demand any wage for educating people with this information, it is because this Quran is to be made accessible for all the people in the world through hard work for their benefit.

105) There are many proofs for it through out the heavens and the earth which people come across yet they pay no attention to them

106) and as a result most of them who commit to working for peace in the name of Allah yet abide by laws of other than Allah.

107) Do they feel that by doing things this way they will remain secure from gloom and doom as is decreed law of Allah for them or that the hour of uprising will not come upon them all of a sudden while they are not expecting it?

108) Tell them clearly, the way Joseph did things is my way too and I invite all of you the people in the world to Allah on the basis of verifiable information that I and my supporters possess. Behold! Sovereignty only belongs to Allah and I am not of those who abide by rule of any other than Allah.

109) All the messengers We sent before you O Muhammad, were human beings of great courage, to such We sent Our revelations after choosing them from among the people of their own township. Have these people who oppose Our guidance not travelled through the land and seen what was the end of those who passed away before them due to ignoring Our advice? From the end results of their ways of doing things you should be able to know that the end result was better for those who did things the way they were consistent with Our advice for their own good. So why don’t you learn things to understand things so that you do things the way they benefit you as a united human community?

110) Respite was always granted to nations until the messengers gave up hope of reformation of their people so they left them to themselves because they came to the conclusion that their people will keep on denying each other their rights to provision, however Our advice came to be of help to those who chose to do things Our way whereby We delivered them their goal but Our foretold consequences could not be averted by those who lived their lives against Our advice and became criminals inflicting harm and destruction upon each other thereby ended up destroyed.

111) There is a lesson in these like accounts of the nations of the past for the people who learn things to understand them for their own betterment. This account of Joseph revealed in the Quran is not an invented tale but a confirmation of previous scriptures, a detailed exposition of all things mankind need to live a good life because it is a roadmap to prosperity for a people who commit to working for peace.

 

[babadeena]

Dear Brother,
Please make your own definition of 'IDOL" or you agree to this definition:
Definition: 1. object of adoration: somebody or something greatly admired or loved, often to excess

2. object worshiped as god: something that is worshiped as a god, e.g. a statue or carved image

3. forbidden object of worship: in monotheistic religions, an object of worship other than the one God
http://encarta.msn.com/encnet/features/dictionary/DictionaryResults.aspx?lextype=3&search=IDOLS

Let us see how every human, orbit thing, Angels, Jinn, Ladies, Saihtaan fixes into that definition.

 

[Mughal1]

مَا الْمَسِيحُ ابْنُ مَرْيَمَ إِلَّا رَسُولٌ قَدْ خَلَتْ مِنْ قَبْلِهِ الرُّسُلُ وَأُمُّهُ صِدِّيقَةٌ ۖ كَانَا يَأْكُلَانِ الطَّعَامَ ۗ انْظُرْ كَيْفَ نُبَيِّنُ لَهُمُ الْآيَاتِ ثُمَّ انْظُرْ أَنَّىٰ يُؤْفَكُونَ {75**
[SIZE=-1][Shakir 5:75] The Messiah, son of Marium is but a messenger; messengers before him have indeed passed away; and his mother was a truthful woman; they both used to eat food. See how We make the communications clear to them, then behold, how they are turned away.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][Pickthal 5:75] The Messiah, son of Mary, was no other than a messenger, messengers (the like of whom) had passed away before him. And his mother was a saintly woman. And they both used to eat (earthly) food. See how We make the revelations clear for them, and see how they are turned away![/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][Yusufali 5:75] Christ the son of Mary was no more than a messenger; many were the messengers that passed away before him. His mother was a woman of truth. They had both to eat their (daily) food. See how Allah doth make His signs clear to them; yet see in what ways they are deluded away from the truth![/SIZE]
قُلْ أَتَعْبُدُونَ مِنْ دُونِ اللَّهِ مَا لَا يَمْلِكُ لَكُمْ ضَرًّا وَلَا نَفْعًا ۚ وَاللَّهُ هُوَ السَّمِيعُ الْعَلِيمُ {76**
[SIZE=-1][Shakir 5:76] Say: Do you serve besides Allah that which does not control for you any harm, or any profit? And Allah-- He is the Hearing, the Knowing.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][Pickthal 5:76] Say: Serve ye in place of Allah that which possesseth for you neither hurt nor use? Allah it is Who is the Hearer, the Knower.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][Yusufali 5:76] Say: "Will ye worship, besides Allah, something which hath no power either to harm or benefit you? But Allah,- He it is that heareth and knoweth all things."

My dear again, Prophet is being included with "MINDoonallah", Will your criteria apply now. or you wish to redefine the
"Definition" of Mindoonallah. Still it is time for both of us.
[/SIZE]

Dear brother, if you look at 98/1&6, you will see allah addressing ahlal kitaab and mushrikoon together. Likewise in 5/75&76. So mindoonillah here are idols again and not jesus because allah excluded him and his mother from mindoonillah. Please remmeber there are a few different peole living in madinah when surah al maaida was revealed eg jews, christians, sabien as well as polytheists.





Surah 13 AR-RAAD – The Tumult/Chaos

In the name of Allah the gracious the merciful

1) Alif Laam Meem Raa. These are proofs for making the case for the constitution which is revealed to you from your Lord for the set goal of peace between mankind yet most of the people commit not to working for peace.

2) Your Lord is Allah alone Who has raised the cosmic bodies without any visible connecting links that you can see therefore His sovereignty extends over all the kingdom whereby He has subjected the sun and the moon to His laws so each is pursuing its set out program for an appointed time and that is how He regulates all affairs in the universe as He has explained through His revelations so that you meet the set standard of your Lord for your peace and prosperity with full confidence.

3) He it is Who has expanded the earth and brought about therein high mountains and low valleys flowing with water whereby He brought about fruits of every kind resembling each other as well as He brought about the phenomenon of the night by covering the daylight. Surely therein are proofs for those who learn and think about purposes for existence of things, how they are brought about and evolved and the way they work to fulfil their set out purposes.

4) In the earth there are tracts side by side of gardens of grapes, of cornfields and of palm trees with single and multi trunks, they are all watered with the same water yet we make some of them excel in taste than others. Surely therein are evidences for people who use their intelligence to learn and understand things.

5) Now if there is anything that seems strange then it is their asking, as we the human community are lying in dust due to rifts and wars, is there any way that we could be raised to dignified level of character again? It is strange because these are the people who oppose the program of their Lord that leads to dignified character so how can they? Because of that they cannot be free of yokes they have put around each other’s necks that are making their lives hard and unbearable and so they are the ones who will end up in yet more agony and suffering and live therein for as long as they live unless they rise up to change things for the betterment of themselves through help of this program.

6) By not accepting and following the given program they are telling you they rather inflict yet more harm and destruction upon each other than go for peace and prosperity as a united people and due to similar mindset, attitude and behaviour destroyed themselves many of the generations that passed away before them, even though your Lord is provider of protection for the mankind against harm and destruction they inflict upon each other yet He is also strict in enforcing His law of consequences to make people face the results of their own actions.

7) The opposers of Our goals and guidelines say, why is no proof sent to him by his Lord as per our demand? But do they not realise that your job is to delivering the given message to them? You are a warner against the consequences of not following the given program just like warners that were sent to every nation before them and their revelations carried their own proofs within them needing no miracles that served no purpose.

8) Allah made obvious for people what each community had to carry out but they excelled in carrying out their responsibilities or fell short of what was expected of them was also made obvious for them as results of their actions. Everything has a set program from Him to follow.

9) He alone is in a unique position to make obvious for the mankind the future results of their actions as well as the present.

10) It makes no difference to the way the results are made obvious whether any of you do things in private for yourselves or in the open for the community, whether any of you do things under the cover of darkness or walk about doing things in broad daylight.

11) For each nation there is a set place among nations according to the set universal laws of Allah that decide its place, there are nations before or in front of it and nations after or behind it that surround it. All are subject to law of cause and effect so they reap what they sow because Allah never changes the condition of a people for the better by suspending His law of cause and effect therefore until they take steps to change themselves as a people for the betterment of themselves no such change can occur and letting things get worse can lead them only to further harm and destruction. Behold, when Allah by His this rule afflicts a people with misfortune it is only because they bring it upon themselves therefore none can ward it off them because that is the set rule of Allah nor can they find any protector against His rule other than following the proper course of actions.

12) He is the One Who shows you the lightning that causes you to become concerned as well as brings you hope of prosperity by means of heavy laden clouds.

13) That is how the thunder strives hard to manifest His glory and so do the people on His mission out of loyalty to Him and the mankind. Moreover He sends them to strike down any people who work hard towards their own destruction because they fight against the mission of Allah but He is strict in taking care of His mission.

14) Invitation to His rule alone is the right one because those who invite to rules of others than Him they can never fulfil them at all. They are like a man with his hands stretched out towards the water as if waiting for it to reach his mouth but it does not. Therefore invitation of those who oppose mission of Allah calling towards rules of other than Him is nothing more than an exercise in vain

15) because whatever is in the heavens and the earth is bound by universal laws of Allah regardless of having the ability to choose or not and so do even their own shadows be it during the day or be it during the night.

16) So ask them, who is really then the ruler of all the cosmic bodies including this earth? Say, it is Allah alone and ask them, when this is the actual fact then why do you set up rules by others than Him who in reality do not control any benefit or harm even concerning themselves? Say, are the blind/senseless and the seeing/sensible equal or is the darkness/ignorance same as the light/knowledge? Or have those whom they take for sovereigns created anything like the creation of Allah in their sight that they have the right to be the rulers beside Allah? Say, if that is not the case then why do you not accept Allah as the only creator of all things and therefore the only one with right to sovereignty, the one Irresistible.

17) He alone sends down water from the heaven and each channel starts flowing according to its measure whereby the torrent bears a swelling foam like the scum which appears from the metals that are melted in the furnace for making ornaments and utensils. By such exemplary arguments Allah proves what is true and what is false. As for the scum, it is thrown away due to being worthless but that which is useful for the mankind remains behind in the land. This is how Allah puts forth exemplary arguments to prove His message clearly.

18) Excellent results await for the actions of those who respond to the program of their Lord. As for those who do not respond to His manifesto even if they had all that is in the earth and as much more beside that to offer as a ransom in order to save themselves from the painful suffering that is to follow them as a result of their own harmful and destructive actions it will not be accepted of them. They are to land themselves in terrible consequences of their own actions that will make their lives hell and that is a terribly painful state to be in.

19) Is he who has made himself aware that it is the verifiable truth that has been sent to you by your Lord like the one who deprives himself of knowledge? Only those who learn to understand things properly become sensible and conscientious.

20) Such as fulfil their constitutional obligations by Allah for the benefit of the human community so they do not fall short of their commitment to rule of Allah for the benefit of human community.

21) And such as bring together people to form a good human society on the basis of that which is revealed by Allah because they pay attention to program of their Lord as they fear the harmful and destructive consequences of their actions if they do not.

22) And such as remain steadfastly engaged in mission of their Lord in order to achieve His set out goal of peace between mankind through establishing the community supportive network in order to open up for all Our provided livelihood for them happily and openly in order to turn round the harmful and destructive human society with goodness. These like people are bound to end up in an excellent state of affairs in time.

23) Blissful kingdoms they will enter and so would such as will mend rifts between people in order to bring about peaceful societies from among their elders and their friends as well as their youngsters and the administrators will enter upon them from every gate

24) saying, you have achieved peace due to your steadfastness in pursuit of your program therefore excellent indeed is the state of affairs for you in the end.

25) As for those who fulfil not their constitutional obligation by Allah for the benefit of the mankind after declaring their commitment to the program of Allah and instead of bringing people together to form a good human society as per direction of Allah cause rifts between mankind thereby wars in the land therefore upon such rest humiliation and destruction because such are bound to end up in such state of affairs.

26) Allah gives vast provisions for any people that work towards that so they end up happy with their worldly life yet the worldly life compared to the hereafter is just a brief enjoyment.

27) After all this explanation those who oppose our guidance still say, why has no miracle been sent to him by his Lord as per our demand? Say, Allah lets go astray whoever so desires by remaining ignorant of His program and He guides to His program whoever works hard to study it to understand it and implement it to turn it into a reality.

28) Such are those who commit to working for peace with full confidence in their minds due to program of Allah. Beware! The confidence in minds comes only through study of the program of Allah.

29) So those who commit to working for peace and strive hard to mend rifts between people to bring about peace there will be blissful life for them and a wonderful kingdom to end up in.

30) That is why We have sent you among this final people as the final messenger with Our final guidance just like we sent messengers to all the nations gone before this, so that you proclaim to them this program that has been revealed to you yet they stand in opposition to the program of the one Who raises mankind to dignity. Say, He alone is my Lord and there is no sovereign other than Him in this kingdom therefore in His set up universal laws I place my trust and to His set out goal for mankind I turn to accomplish it.

31) So no miracles are needed for the goal set for the mankind to accomplish because had the purpose of this Quran been to be move the mountains or to slice the earth, or to raise the dead and speak with them then this very Quran would have done all that but the purpose of this Quran is only to guide mankind through this program as to how they should live in this world to have a blissful life for themselves as a single family working together for the good of each other in the name of their Lord in the hope of a better hereafter. So it is up to people to accept this Quran as a guidance or reject it and see the results for themselves for their actions without this guidance. However upon universal laws of Allah depends outcome of all that happens. Do those who have committed to working for peace not realise that had Allah enforced His will He could have forced all the people to follow His program? So those who oppose Our guidance they will continue to be stricken with disaster or it will come near to their homesuntil the promise of Allah comes true in form of revolts or civil wars and wars between nations because Allah breaks not the link between the cause and the effect.

32 Surely messengers before you were mocked even though I gave respite to those who opposed them for learning and understanding their program yet they heeded not so in time l caught them inflicting harm upon each other to the point of destruction, so how true was My warning in their case?

33) So is there any like Him Who has established such universal laws to bring each person the results of what it does? Not at all yet they live by rules of other than Allah. Say, name any of them that you think truly have the right to rule or are you telling Him of something He is unaware of in this universe or is it just a matter of coining words for you? Indeed to the rejecters and opposers of rule of Allah their own scheming is made pleasing by each other and that is how they are taken away from the program of Allah by each other. So whomever Allah lets stray at his own will has no guide to guide him.

34) Such will suffer in this world and their suffering will only get worst in time to come as there is nothing to protect them other than the program of Allah which they themselves have decided to reject and oppose.

35) A description of the blissful kingdom which those who are consistent with the program of Allah for the benefit of humanity are told to bring about is that rivers of livelihood should flow throughout it and its provisions should be continuous to provide shelter from all sort of troubles and hardships. Such should be the land of those who are consistent with program of Allah for the good of mankind and in comparison the land of those who reject and oppose His program will a place full of pain and suffering.

36) This is why those to whom We have given the scriptures before this and they really act upon it rejoice at what has been sent to you though there are others in the same groups who reject some parts of it. Say, I am ordered to serve rule of Allah alone and not set up any other rulers with Him. Upon His set up universal laws I rely not magic or miracles and towards His program I turn for guidance which is realistic and practical.

37) And this is the very purpose for which We have sent Our framework for governance of Our kingdom in a language that makes things clear for mankind for all times to come. However if you the followers of Our program were to follow the make beliefs of opposers of Our program after Our set out goals and guidelines have reached you then you will have nothing to protect you from falling victim to harms and destructions that Allah has already warned you against.

38) And for the very same reason of implementing Our program for the benefit of the mankind We sent messengers before you whereby We brought about for them supporters by means of ideological following. It was never fitting for a messenger to bring people any proof save the program of Allah because for each period there was a clearly set out program.

39) Allah erased or established nations as per His declared programs because with Him rested the right and the responsibility for originating all the programs for the good of the mankind.

40) For that reason O messenger, whether We show you some of what We have foretold them or We terminate your life before that matters not because your job is to deliver Our message but with Our set out universal laws rests their accountability.

41) Do they not see that We bring about the gradual contraction of the earth from all its sides due to Our set out universal laws? Therefore it should be clear to you the mankind that right to rule belongs to Allah alone and there is none to override His set out program because He is strict in holding all things within their set limits.

42) Behold! Those before them schemed against Our programs but all their schemes were within set limits of Allah. He makes obvious the results of all that which each nation does therefore in time those who oppose His program will come to know who is to end up in a blissful kingdom.

43) Yet those who oppose Our program say, you are not a messenger. Say, the universal laws set out by Allah are sufficient as a proof between me and you as well as the person who has learned and understood His book.






[FONT=&amp][/FONT]Surah 14 IBRAHEEM

Proclaim in the name of Allah, the Gracious, the Merciful.

1) Alif Laam Raa. A manifesto, the one We have revealed to you for the purpose that you bring mankind out of their darkness of utter ignorance whereby they inflict harm and destruction upon each other into the brilliant light of wisdom for their own benefit by way of community building program of their Lord for a proper way of doing things as advised by the almighty to whom belongs the sovereignty of this whole kingdom of universe.

2) It is Allah alone to Whom belongs all that is in all the galaxies including this galaxy yet terrible humiliation and destruction is to be the end of those who reject and oppose His program and do as they please in their ignorance based arrogance.

3) They are those who love rivalry for short term gains for themselves in life of this world at the expense of people of their own communities instead of building a better future for themselves as a single nation and that is how they hinder others from the program of Allah always conspiring to make it look crooked or unworkable. Such people have strayed far off the proper track that works for the good of humanity.

4) We have not sent any messenger but he spoke the language that his people could understand so that he could explain to them Our program clearly. That is why Allah leaves only such people to themselves who refuse to study and follow His program and guides all who learn to understand and follows His program because He is mighty wise provider of rules that regulate all affairs properly.

5) Likewise We sent Moses speaking language of his people with Our manifesto with goals and guideline saying, lead your people out of darkness of utter ignorance whereby they inflict harm and destruction upon each other into the brilliant light of wisdom to make them strive hard as a good organised community based upon Our constitution for bringing about days of prosperity and peace for themselves. Surely in that are proofs about the truth of the message for those who would be steadfast in working for their own betterment.

6) Call to mind the time when Moses said to his people, strive hard always to maintain the blissful program of Allah as an obligation upon you as a nation whereby He saved you from the people of Pharaoh who subjected you to painful suffering by undermining your courageous people by bringing to life divisions among your people thereby making you a nation of weak people. Surely in all of this there was a tremendous struggle put up by you as you were advised by your glorious Lord.

7) Remember when your Lord warned you that if you will work according to My program for your progress and prosperity as a community then I will let that increase for you but if you will instead oppose My program then I will let you face results of your own actions strictly in form of harm and destruction that you inflict upon each other.

8) Moreover Moses made it absolutely clear to you that if you and all the people dwelling on the earth ignored His program it will do no harm to Allah but yourselves.

9) Has the account of those gone before not reached you such as the people of Noah, Aad, Thamud and those who came after them? No one really knows them other than Allah. Their messengers too came to them with same clear guidelines for the same goal but they bit their hands with their mouths in rage and said, we certainly reject and fiercely oppose the program with which you claim to have been sent because we very much doubt the message to which you invite us is really from Allah for our good.

10) Their messengers responded, have you really any reasonable doubt about the goodness of program of Allah Who is the originator of the heavens and the earth? He is the One Who invites you to His program with all necessary proofs so that He relieves you and protects you from the harms and destructions that you inflict upon each other to give you secure future through His program based on unity for prosperity for a set period of time as determined by His universal laws. They said, you are only a human being like ourselves and you only wish to turn us away from our rulers whom our forefathers served because you want to become our ruler. Bring us some miracle that we demand if you want us to change our minds about you and your allegedly divine message.

11) Their messengers replied to them, it is true that we are humans like yourselves but Allah bestows His program for blissful life of mankind on any of His people who are only too pleased to work for His set out mission. It is not part of our job to bring you any miracles as you demand due to your ignorance but to deliver you whatever proofs Allah himself sees fit to furnish you with and He has chosen the guidance itself for that purpose. This is why it is up to people whether they learn to understand the message to implement it for their own good or simply reject it and oppose it without giving it due attention and keep on suffering the self inflicted harm and destruction.

12) So tell us what better reason do we really have not to put our trust in universal laws of Allah when He has guided us to live our lives in ways that can bring us a great life through prosperity and peace in form of brotherhood of mankind working for good of each other as oppose to working against each other as enemies? We will certainly face your persecution with steadfastness till Allah shows both of us who fairs better in the end, the family working as one like us or a divided family that is in rivalry with each other like you leading itself to its destruction. So let those who want to put their trust in anything put their trust in universal laws of Allah, the bedrock for a good human society.

13) Finally the opposers of Our guidance, the harmful and destructive political and religious leadership of the people said to their messengers, abide by our traditional rule or we will expel you from our land. That is why their Lord revealed His forecast to them as law of consequences that We will let these destructive people destroy themselves through inflicting harm and destruction upon each other because this is how We deal with people who refuse to take our advice and instead choose to do as they please.

14) That is how We have passed on the land to you to dwell therein after they are gone by destroying themselves. This is a lesson for such as keep in their minds My role and pay attention to My set out program for them always.

15) As is made obvious for mankind by My message and the events of the past, calling My program into question always proved terrible for every tyrant and oppressor of his people and his supporters and followers.

16) Such a one spreads hell all around himself whereby he satisfies his thirst for hatred and bloodshed of his own people.

17) He partakes in it in steps but never reaches the point of satisfaction and defeat and destruction gradually surrounds him more and more from all sides yet he does not give up his harmful and destructive desire despite his being surrounded by terrible pain and suffering.

18) The likeness of the hard works of those who gather benefits for themselves at the expense of the human community in opposition to the program of their Lord is like that of small amount of gathered ashes which the wind scatters on a stormy day leaving no trace of them to be seen. They will get nothing from their such hard works against Our program save harm and destruction or pain and suffering and this is what straying far away from the program of their lord means for them, that is an unsatisfied regrettable life.

19) Can you therefore not see that Allah has evolved all the heavenly bodies including the heavenly body upon which you live for a set purpose? It serves His plan to erase you and replace you with new generations

20) so it should be obvious to mankind that it is not at all difficult for Allah to fulfil His goal as planned.

21) Rest assured in time gradually all people will be brought under the constitution of Allah to abide by because from among the opponents of the divine rule the influenced masses will start waking up asking questions of those who think of themselves as overwhelmingly influential saying, we have been serving and following you all our lives so can you do anything to free us from the painful suffering we are in that Allah warned us against? They will reply, had we learned from the message of Allah then we could have guided you too. Since we did not so it makes no difference now whether we panic or bear the consequences of our actions with patience because there is no escape for us unless we learn the message and mend our ways accordingly.

22) That is how the harmful and destructive leadership will conclude in the end saying to its masses, surely Allah promised you results of your actions and promise of Allah proved true and in opposition to that I too promised you things but I broke my promise to you. I just asked you to take me for your leader and you just accepted my leadership without ensuring whether I had the power to deliver things or not. So do not blame me for taking advantage of you instead blame your own stupidity for giving yourselves into my control. I am not bothered with your moaning just as you are not bothered with my crying. I now refuse to be taken as your sovereign like before because such transgressors end up in painful suffering as we have experienced ourselves already

23) and as we have learned by now, those who commit to working for peace and strive hard to mend rifts between mankind to bring peace between them will indeed end up in kingdoms within which will flow like rivers all things of their need and desire to live therein according to the program of their Lord. That is how they will accomplish mission of peace and security.

24) Do you not see how Allah shows similarity between the program that gradually leads mankind to peace through prosperity with a tree that gradually develops from a seed into a fully grown tree bearing desirable fruit, which is rooted properly in the ground that is why its branches are well spread and high above the ground?

25) It yields its fruits in every season due to set out universal laws by its Lord. Allah cites these like examples for people so that they struggle hard to spread His manifesto to gather people together on basis of His constitution for a progressive and prosperous peaceful future.

26) Likewise the comparison of a wrong goal with wrong plan of actions is that of a harmful tree with undesirable fruit that fails to develop properly because it is not rooted properly so it can be pulled out of the ground and is therefore unstable.

27) With His program based upon firmly established foundation, Allah makes those who commit to working for peace on its basis steadfast and firmly established in the life of this world as well as in the life to come but Allah lets the opposers of His program go stray because Allah does things as per His plan.

28) Have you not seen the behaviour of those people who have substituted the blissful program of Allah with their make beliefs whereby they drive their nation into a state of no return?

29) Hell is their life therein wherein their energies are continuously consumes without any beneficial results, a terrible state of existence to be in.

30) The political and religious chiefs of people set up rulers other than Allah to mislead their people from His roadmap. Tell them, you the chiefs may enjoy yourself at the expense of your masses for a while but your final destination is going to be painful suffering and destruction.

31) Say to my supporters who have committed to working for peace, strive with this Quran for establishing My system for opening up for all whatever We have provided for the benefit of the mankind individually as well as a community before there comes the time when peaceful change of the system is no longer the option because there is no more tolerance between people and violent uprising becomes inevitable.

32) Thereby let people know that it is Allah alone Who has evolved all the heavenly bodies including this heavenly body wherein you abide and causes water to rain down from the height whereby He brings forth all sorts of fruits for your sustenance. He has made it possible for you to use ships so that they sail through the sea by way of His set out universal laws and so has He brought about rivers for your service.

33) Even the sun and the moon are subjected to His universal laws moving along set out courses and likewise is subjected to His laws the phenomenon of the night and the day for your benefit.

34) He has given you all that you will ever need and more, so much so that even if you decided to use the blessings of Allah, you could never be able to use them yet mankind is going about things the wrong way by ignoring and opposing Our program.

35) Remember the time when Abraham said, My Lord! Make this dwelling place for humanity a place of peace through the program for progress and prosperity thereby protect and secure me and my ideological following from personality cults wherein some make masses take other people as their rulers instead of You my Lord.

36) O Lord! Chiefs and Priests of nations have been using the individuals to rule their people and thereby led the masses away from Your program into their cults therefore only those who follow me in following Your program belong to my nation and as to any who oppose me, they are bound to end up destroyed because You are protector of only those of the mankind who follow Your blissful program.

37) Our Lord! I have settled some of my ideological following in a valley that is not civilised according to Your dignifying constitution. Our Lord! I have done this in the hope that they establish Your ruling system therein by spreading Your program therefore turn the minds of the people of the nations toward them for guidance and provide them with results of their actions for the benefit of the mankind so that they all become a worthy people.

38) Our Lord! Certainly You make known our real motives behind our actions that we try to hide from each other by results of our action as well as those we try to make obvious to each other because nothing is hidden from You, Allah in the earth or the rest of the universe.

39) That is how it should be clear for the mankind that sovereignty belongs to Allah alone who has appointed Ishmael and Isaac as my ideological supporters and successors for the continuation of the set out mission for me as I come close to end of my time. Indeed my Lord takes care of all needs of all things according to His set out program.

40) O Lord! Give me and my ideological supporters courage through Your program to establish and maintain your system. Our Lord! Continue guiding us for fulfil your mission.

41) Thereby our Lord! Protect me and elderly and youngsters in my nation such as are committed to working for peace on the day of sudden violent uprising when people face the results of their own actions.

42) So O my people, be well prepared for the mission of Allah and never let the opposers of His program think that Allah is unaware of what these transgressors are up to. He is only giving them respite from the results of their actions to correct themselves and that is till the tipping point is reached when their eyes will become fixed staring in horror as sudden revolt overwhelms them because of what they will have done.

43) They will be running in terror with their heads uplifted in horror, staring but seeing nothing and their minds utterly vacant of any thoughts as to what they should do to save themselves from harm and destruction. Nothing new because such revolts have already happened amongst many generations in the past and will continue happening till people come to their sense and learn to abide by the given program.

44) O messenger, alert mankind about the time when Our forewarned consequences of their harmful and destructive actions against each other will overtake them and that is when the transgressors will say, our Lord! Give us a little more respite and we will respond to Your invitation with all due respect and support the people who come to us with your program. But it will be said to them, are you not the same people who once swore that you would never come to your destruction due to what you believe and do

45) despite living in places of people who already destroyed each other before you the same way? It was already explained to you how nicely We dealt with them yet due to their own stupidity We made them a lesson for you.

46) They hatched their conspiracies against Our program but their plots were well within control of Allah even though these plots were such that could move masses in their support.

47) But never think that Allah will not fulfil His promise to His messengers that program of Allah will be succeed because Allah rules through power of wisdom.

48) So alert people about the time when the landscape in the land will be changed to a different landscape and the people living above the law will be brought down to abide by constitution of Allah, the One Irresistible.

49) That is how in time to come you will see the transgressors against the rule of Allah bound together as if in chains rising up together against the rule of Allah,

50) their whole program will be wrapped up in gloom and doom because their goals will be covered up in fire of hatred between the mankind.

51) For that reason Allah will reward each such person according to what one does because Allah is strictly swift in calling people to account for their actions.

52) This Quran is a manifesto for all the people so alert them thereby and let them know that Allah alone is the sovereign in this kingdom of the universe, so let the people with understanding strive hard to spread His program for its implementation as a constitution for them.

 

[babadeena]

So mindoonillah here are idols again and not jesus because allah excluded him and his mother from mindoonillah.

Brother, Quran is saying that People who were believers of that creed worshiped them minDoonallah (in addition to Allah, Beside Allah),
you are again and again categorizing them as IDOL.

اتَّخَذُوا أَحْبَارَهُمْ وَرُهْبَانَهُمْ أَرْبَابًا مِنْ دُونِ اللَّهِ وَالْمَسِيحَ ابْنَ مَرْيَمَ وَمَا أُمِرُوا إِلَّا لِيَعْبُدُوا إِلَٰهًا وَاحِدًا ۖ لَا إِلَٰهَ إِلَّا هُوَ ۚ سُبْحَانَهُ عَمَّا يُشْرِكُونَ [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]{31**[/FONT]
[SIZE=-1][Shakir 9:31] They have taken their doctors of law and their monks for lords besides Allah, and (also) the Messiah son of Marium and they were enjoined that they should serve one Allah only, there is no god but He; far from His glory be what they set up (with Him).[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][Pickthal 9:31] They have taken as lords beside Allah their rabbis and their monks and the Messiah son of Mary, when they were bidden to worship only One Allah. There is no Allah save Him. Be He Glorified from all that they ascribe as partner (unto Him)![/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1][Yusufali 9:31] They take their priests and their anchorites to be their lords in derogation of Allah, and (they take as their Lord) Christ the son of Mary; yet they were commanded to worship but One Allah: there is no god but He. Praise and glory to Him: (Far is He) from having the partners they associate (with Him).[/SIZE]
Perhaps this may help. I really do not understand how and why you are insisting that
everything which was worshiped or is being worshiped (Mindonnallah) Beside Allah, in addition to
Allah is IDOL. And also A person who worships BESIDE ALLAH SOMETHING ELSE, by what title
he is called?

 

[Mughal1]

Dear Brother,
Please make your own definition of 'IDOL" or you agree to this definition:
Definition: 1. object of adoration: somebody or something greatly admired or loved, often to excess

2. object worshiped as god: something that is worshiped as a god, e.g. a statue or carved image

3. forbidden object of worship: in monotheistic religions, an object of worship other than the one God
http://encarta.msn.com/encnet/features/dictionary/DictionaryResults.aspx?lextype=3&search=IDOLS

Let us see how every human, orbit thing, Angels, Jinn, Ladies, Saihtaan fixes into that definition.

Yes, they are objects of worship as god for polytheists and they are idols but also they are told as midoonillah by allah and that they will be fuel of hell fire.

It is not me who is saying they will end up in hell but alah himself as I already quoted from the quran in one of my earlier posts in the other thread.

So to be minddonillah they need to be all that I just stated about them ie they need to be idols, they need to be feul for hell fire, they need to be accepted by allah that they are mindoonillah as mushrik claim them to be their gods. Once all these conditions are met then they are mindoonillah. Other uses of mindoonillah by other matter not eg as the sun is called mindoonillah by hudhuda as quoted by allah.

http://www.answering-christianity.com/quran/qi032.htm

021.098 YUSUFALI: Verily ye, (unbelievers), and the (false) gods that ye worship besides Allah, are (but) fuel for Hell! to it will ye (surely) come!

021.099 YUSUFALI: If these had been gods, they would not have got there! but each one will abide therein.

http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=21&tid=33497

The Idolators and their gods are Fuel for Hell
Allah says to the people of Makkah, the idolators of the Quraysh and those who followed their religion of idol worship:

http://islamic-replies.ucoz.com/Will_Jesus_go_to_hell.html



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Surah 15 AL-HIJR – THE BEDROCK FOR COMMUNITY

Proclaim in the name of Allah, the Gracious, the Merciful.

1) Alif Laam Raa. These are arguments for the implementation of this constitution in form of Glorious Quran.

2) The time is coming when those who oppose this program will wish they submitted to it for their peace and security.

3) Leave these self centred leaders and supporters who partake in the world the way that makes them happy at the expense of each other deluded as they are by false goals because soon they will come to know and regret the ways they live their lives as they are gradually led to self destruction.

4) Never did We let any township destroy itself whose term of life was not determined by law of consequences for peoples’ own actions.

5) No people can bring their self destruction quicker or can delay it but as per set out universal laws.

6) They say, O you who claims that this program is revealed to him by Allah for implementation! You are talking nonsense

7) because in that case why have you not been sent with supporting soldiers like a king if you are really truthful in your claim that you are sent by Allah to establish His rule?

8) Let them know clearly that We do not send Our messengers with soldiers unless it serves Our purpose because had they come to them that way then they could not have time to consider the message.

9) Surely We have revealed this program for mankind to think it through thoroughly so that through implementation of this program We provide them with security.

10) That is the reason why We sent messengers before you among the earlier nations the way We have sent you for this people,

11) though there never came to them a messenger but their political and religious leadership mocked him just like these chiefs and their supporters mock you.

12) That is why We leave such people to themselves to keep on conspiring against Our guidance as their harmful and destructive mindsets and attitudes guide them therefore they continue in their crimes against humanity while spreading falsehood against Our program to create doubts in minds of their people so that they do not commit to working for peace and fight against Our messengers instead.

13) Behaviour of these chiefs and their supporters is likewise so they too do not commit to working for peace despite the examples of the people who destroyed themselves before them assuming their masses are under their full control so will not revolt against their tyranny and abuse.

14) For this very reason if We open a way for masses to explore the universe and they keep on ascending into space using that way,

15) still these people will say, our eyes are seeing things or rather we have been duped for such an experience cannot be real, it is impossible.

16) No matter how silly are remarks of these people the fact is We have brought about in space galaxies full of stars and beautifully arranged them for those who wish to observe them for their set out purpose.

17) That is why We guarded them against any wrong force that may misinterpret and misuse them,

18) so only such a person will observe them properly as is overwhelmed by piercing curiosity of existence, purpose and function.

19) Moreover We expanded the earth and brought about mountains therein and caused in it everything to grow,

20) and We provided therein means of sustenance for you and others for whom you are not responsible to care for them.

21) There is nothing which is not in Our storage in an unending quantity/amount but we bring forth only as much as is appropriate.

22) We give rise to the fertilizing winds and send down fresh water from the height for you the mankind to drink, it is not your chiefs and priests who own the store of this wealth.

23) That is how We bring nations to life through Our program and let them perish if they follow it not because to Us belongs ownership of all that exists.

24) Indeed We make obvious those who rush forth to take control of things from among you to exclude others and We also make obvious those from among you who end up losing as a result of this senseless rivalry.

25) Surely your Lord is going to bring them all together through His this program and that is how He makes known to mankind that He rules the universe through wisdom.

26) We surely brought about man ignorant about everything who needed to be cultivated into a civilised human being through Our program like a piece of clay that is like mud which is moulded into a desire shape.

27) As for the dominant harmful and destructive ruling and priestly elite we exposed it before the mankind spreading hatred among people.

28) Call to mind when your Lord sent message to the chiefs at the time by way of His messenger saying, I am going to cultivate a man through My program for him into a highly civilised human being like a piece of clay that is like mud which is moulded into a desired shape

29) and when I have completed My moulding of him into a shape I want for him thereby make him conscious of Me by way of My revelation then commit yourselves to support him as your chief.

30) That is why all the chiefs together committed themselves to supporting him

31) save Iblees who refused to join those who committed themselves for this purpose.

32) Allah asked, O Iblees! What is the matter with you that you did not join those who committed themselves for supporting Adam?

33) He replied, it is not fitting for a person of my status coming from elite class that I commit myself for supporting this man whom You have cultivated from among low status people like a piece of clay that is like mud which is moulded into a shape.

34) Allah replied to him through his messenger at the time, leave the title you were granted as a chief in this office because you are sacked

35) and you will remain excluded from My promised blissful life till the time you judge things according to My set out constitution.

36) At this Iblees requested, Lord! Give me time to reflect till the day the office holders take their offices as officials.

37) Allah said, you are given the respite

38) till the day of appointment of the officials.

39) Iblees said, Lord! Since You denied me my office because of this man, I will make my way of life attractive to him and his associates in the land and I will conspire to lead them out of their offices as well

40) save those of them who are sincerely devoted to Your program.

41) Allah said, see this program from Me is firmly founded upon proofs

42) so you have no power against my officials firmly based upon knowledge from Me but only those arrogant and ignorant will follow your way of life and become of the humiliated

43) and that is how they all will end up in painful suffering,

44) wherein lead many ways, each way of life is assigned to a separate community of people from among the mankind.

45) However those who will develop proper mindset and attitude and do as they are guided will end up in the middle of blissful kingdoms with fountains of knowledge from which will spring peace and prosperity

46) That is why they are told, enter in to these for your own peace and security.

47) We will remove all hatred from their minds against each other making them like brothers settled on seats of dignity due to supporting each other.

48) No fatigue should touch them in there due to working for each other and they should not do anything that kicks them out of that state of existence.

49) Thereby let My devotees make obvious for the mankind that I am indeed gracious and merciful

50) and that My set out consequences for actions of people are also humiliating and very painful.

51) Tell them about the missionaries that came to people of Abraham.

52) They entered upon them and said, we come to you for your peace and security. But he replied, surely we are anxious to know about your future plan.

53) They answered, worry not about it, we have come to you with a good news of a successor endowed with knowledge.

54) He said, are you giving me the good news of successor because I am getting old? What kind of good news is this that you are giving me?

55) They replied, the good news we are giving you is because of the continuation of the mission so that you do not become of those who despair.

56) He said, who will get bored with blissful program of his Lord other than the one who strays?

57) Then he asked, what is your current mission that you have been sent for, O people on a mission?

58) They replied, we have been sent by our prophet to deal with a people who commit crimes among themselves as well as against other people

59) with the exception of a party that supports Lot, we will certainly evacuate all of them

60) except his party of people that opposes him, which is going to stay with those chiefs and priests who will remain behind.

61) So when the missionaries came to the people of Lot,

62) he said, you people seem to be those who fight those who commit crimes?

63) They said, we have come to you with a solution regarding that whereby these people cause trouble.

64) We have been sent on a mission and we are to fulfil it.

65) You should therefore depart with your supporters during the last hours of the night and you yourself should follow them at their rear and let none of you look back to this place with any regrets instead keep going where you are told to go.

66) We informed him about this decree of Ours that the roots of those who remain behind are soon to be cut off through this new beginning.

67) Behold! The people of the township came rejoicing to Lot at the news of his visitors.

68) Lot said, they are my guests so do not humiliate me before them

69) instead be consistent with rule of Allah for the good of the community and do not put me to shame in front of my guests by doing things you usually do to each other and the travellers through our township.

70) They said, have we not stopped you from speaking on behalf of people in the rest of the world?

71) He said, here are my basis upon which I stand and invite you to abide by if you must do anything purposeful and worthwhile at all because living a life of crime inflicting harm on others is a waste of life.

72) Just like way of life of your people O messenger, they were driven to madness through rivalries for power and wealth!

73) So the mighty revolt in form of a sudden tumult overtook them by one morning

74) because We caught the place turned upside down due to their revolt against Our program as We made obvious to it importance of organised institutions and record keeping in a classified way.

75) Surely there are evidences in this for those who will care to investigate as to what happens to people who refuse to do things properly and why.

76) And as it happens this ruined township lies on the highway you travel.

77) Indeed there is a lesson in this for those who commit to working for peace.

78) The people who lived in the land full of trees and greenery to whom was sent Shuaib were also of those who inflicted harm and destruction upon each other

79) so We sent Our program to guide them but they ignored it. The ruined townships of both the nations lay by the road used most frequently by you the people.

80) The people who lived in land of rocky hills also denied the God given rights of provision to their people as told by their messengers.

81) because We furnished them with Our revelations but they too ignored them.

82) They used to carve their homes in the mountains for safety

83) but the mighty sudden uprising took them by surprise one morning so all their hard labour to build secure place for themselves avail them not at all.

84) We have not created all the far away galaxies and this galaxy and all that is between them but for a set purpose.

85) The moment of doom is for sure to strike those who abide not by Our program, so face their opposition in a courageous way that is dignified.

86) Surely your Lord makes obvious for mankind what dignified behaviour is.

87) That is why We have brought to your attention many evidences that back up The Quran that raises mankind to height of dignified existence.

88) So look not at the power and wealth which We have let some political and religious elite gather for themselves at the expense of human community as a favour from Us because they gathered it by declaring war against Our guidance, and furthermore grieve not at the suffering of those who continuously support the same system that hurts them and yet they ignore and oppose Our guidance. Let them remain caught in their self defeating delusions and instead pay much more attention to those who commit themselves to working for peace

89) and say to the opposing ruling and priestly elite and its following, I am surely sent by Allah as an open and clear warner to all the people.

90) This Quran is indeed the warning like of which We sent to those before you who also decided to remain in the opposite camps and the results of that were made obvious again and again

91) because they too were the ones who tore their constitutions into bits out of disrespect for rule of law and humanity and ended up in animosity whereby they inflicted terrible harm and destruction upon each other.

92) By the evidence of testimony of your Lord! We asked them to be united

93) for all they needed to do for their own good.

94) Therefore proclaim publicly what you are commanded and leave those who choose to abide by rules of other than Allah to their self created delusions.

95) Surely We Ourself will suffice you against the scoffers and the warmongers.

96) As to those who set up rulers other than Allah they will soon come to know the end result of that which they do.

97) We know your mind is distressed by what they say and do

98) therefore strive hard to establish the sovereignty of your Lord and be with those who commit themselves for this task

99) and that is how you should serve the mission of your Lord until there reaches you the news of accomplishment of the mission which is absolutely certain to happen.

 

[babadeena]

Yes, they are objects of worship as god for polytheists and they are idols but also they are told as midoonillah by allah and that they will be fuel of hell fire.

It is not me who is saying they will end up in hell but alah himself as I already quoted from the quran in one of my earlier posts in the other thread.

So to be minddonillah they need to be all that I just stated about them ie they need to be idols, they need to be feul for hell fire, they need to be accepted by allah that they are mindoonillah as mushrik claim them to be their gods. Once all these conditions are met then they are mindoonillah. Other uses of mindoonillah by other matter not eg as the sun is called mindoonillah by hudhuda as quoted by allah.

Post 186 containing 9/31 are all hell fire, then?

 

[babadeena]

Brother Take your time, make up your mind, redefine the 'DEFINITION' I shall join latter now.

"BESIDE ALLAH, WHICH WILL BE WORSHIPED/CRIED, THAT IS HUMAN, LIVING, DEAD,
CREATURES, STATUE, ORBIT THINGS, ANGELS, PROPHETS, SAINTS, PEER, ALL ARE
MINDOONALLAH" I have proved it from Quran, rest I shall prove the remaining one also
Inshallah, latter or tomorrow.

 

[Abdul Allah]

"Ghulam" equivalent word in English comes to "Servants" and in Arabic it is "Ebad".
"Servitude(Abadiyaat) of a human should and must be on Allah". These types of
poetry is pure Shirk.

we are not talking about بندگی
ok tell me being a Ghulam what one should do for the person whose he is a Ghulam

 

[Abdul Allah]

Re: A renowned scholar provoking people to attack Milaad events.

?? ?? ????? ???? ????? ?? ?? ????? ????? ???? ?? ???? ???? ???? ???? ???? ?? ??? ??? ???????? ????? ??? ?? ?? "???? ???? ?? ????? ?? ?? ???? ??????? ????? ?? ????? ?? ???"

????? ????? ???? ?? ???? ????? ??? ??? ????? ???? ?? ?? ????? ???? ?? ????? ??? ????? ???? ?? ??? ???? ???? ??? ?? ????? ????? ???? ?? ?? ???? ??? ???? ?? ????? ????. ???? ?????? ( ???? ??? ?????) ?????? ???? ???.

???? ?? ????? ?????? ?? ???? ?? ?????? ????? ????? ??? ????? ???? ?? ???? ?? ???? ?? ??????? ????? ???? ?? ???? ??? ??? ??? ??? ?? ????? ???? ?? ??? ?? ?? ?????? ???? ???? ????? ????? ??? ????? ???? ?? ????? ?? ??

??? ???? ?? ???? ?? ???? ??? ???? ???? ???? ??? ??? ??? ???? - ????? ?? ??? ??? ??? ???? ?? ???? ???? ?? ????? ??? ????? ????? ?? ????? ??? ?? ???

First of All
I am not Shia

Dr. Israr did a mistake by quoting a Hadith that have doubtfull due to many version(as he himself said). like he himself said that few version said that Imam was not Ali Razi Allah anhoo. then why to quote such hadith??

also When we have other narrations that did not have this incident at all in the books of Hadith about the same Ayath? then why to use such incident that have few doubts??

 

[Abdul Allah]

جی بھائی، شفاعت سے انکار نہیں ہے، اور اپنے اعمال پر گھمنڈ بھی نہیں، الله کی رحمت کی امید ضرور ہے. جس طرح غیر الله کا علم و اختیار محدود ہے، اسی طرح کون شفاعت کرے گا اور کس کی کرے گا محدود ہے.
انکار بہشتی دروازے کا ہے، اس اعتقاد کا ہے کہ ٢٩ دن دودھ میں پانی ملاؤ اور تیسویں دن مزار پر چڑھا دو، نماز نہیں پڑھنی, بزرگ کی تعلیمات پر عمل نہیں کرنا لیکن ہفتہ وار/ماہانہ حاضری ضرور دینی ہے. کس گمان میں؟

تو بھائی مثبت طریقے سے اپنی بات کو پھیلاؤ آپ کے اب تک کی پوسٹس سے تو یہی لگ رہا ہے ک آپ بھی ان لوگوں میں سے ہیں کے جو توحید کا پرچار کرنے کے لئے ہر چیز کو شرک اور ہر بات کو بدعات کی لسٹ میں شامل کرتے ہیں
اور اس مقصد کے لئے پورا قرآن اور تمام احادیث کی بجاے چند ایک کو ہی کافی سمجھتے ہیں.

اورایک بات کہ اگر کوئی نماز اور دیگر اچھے کام جان بوجھ کر چھوڑتا ہے کے شفاعت مل جا ے گی
تو صحیح نہیں

 

[Pakistani1947]

Samar Bhai,

Please read the following hadith from Sahih Bukhari and then tell me what do you conclude from following Hadith.

Narrated 'Abis bin Rabia: 'Umar came near the Black Stone and kissed it and said "No doubt, I know that you are a Stone and can neither benefit anyone nor harm anyone. Had I not seen Allah's Apostle kissing you I would not have kissed you." (Sahih Bukhari Book #26, Hadith #667)

Do you think Umer (RA) would ever kiss anything without ever seen Prophet Muhammad pbuh doing the same act?

Dear pakistani, by this hadith you have proven that kissing things is not shirk. Especially kissing ashraf al makhluqaat ie insaan. This is why in some cultures brothers kiss each other when they meet.
regards and all the best.

Dear Mughal,

Please do not mix regular daily affairs which has nothing to do with barakah or blessing. For example if you kiss your child to show love and affection it is not SHIRK. But on the other hand if you kiss the hand or feet of your Peer NOT ONLY in love and affection, BUT with a believe of getting blessing or Barkah is SHIRK.

Now read the following Hadeeth agains Omer (رَّضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُمْ) kissed the black stone only because he (رَّضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُمْ) saw Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وسلم) kissing it. Do you think that a Sahabi-e-Rashul (رَّضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُمْ) of such caliber would even think of kissing anything else with the intention of getting blessing from that thing without seeing Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وسلم) doing the same act. This hadeeth shows how careful Sahabi-e-Rashul (رَّضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُمْ) were to avoid any involvement in SHIRK. While kissing, he (رَّضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُمْ) provided the reasoning to the people around that why is he kissing the black stone. The message is very clear that he wanted people to avoid kissing something as religious ritual, not done by Prophet Muhammad (صلی اللہ علیہ وآلہ وسلم).

Narrated 'Abis bin Rabia: 'Umar came near the Black Stone and kissed it and said "No doubt, I know that you are a Stone and can neither benefit anyone nor harm anyone. Had I not seen Allah's Apostle kissing you I would not have kissed you." (Sahih Bukhari Book #26, Hadith #667)

Actions which comes under the category of SHIRK are such as hanging up amulets (وہ چھوٹا سا زیور جو نظر بد سے بچنے کے لیے پہنا جاۓ) or wearing a talisman (تعویذ) or string to dispel or ward off calamity (مصیبت دور کرنے کے لیے دھاگہ باندھنا), because everyone who attribute powers to a thing when Allaah has not made it so either according to sharee’ah or according to the laws of the universe, has associated something with Allaah. This also applies to one who touches a thing seeking its barakah (blessing), when Allaah has not created any barakah in it, such as kissing the doors of the mosques, touching their thresholds, seeking healing from their dust, and other such actions.

 

[atensari]

تو بھائی مثبت طریقے سے اپنی بات کو پھیلاؤ آپ کے اب تک کی پوسٹس سے تو یہی لگ رہا ہے ک آپ بھی ان لوگوں میں سے ہیں کے جو توحید کا پرچار کرنے کے لئے ہر چیز کو شرک اور ہر بات کو بدعات کی لسٹ میں شامل کرتے ہیں
اور اس مقصد کے لئے پورا قرآن اور تمام احادیث کی بجاے چند ایک کو ہی کافی سمجھتے ہیں.

اورایک بات کہ اگر کوئی نماز اور دیگر اچھے کام جان بوجھ کر چھوڑتا ہے کے شفاعت مل جا ے گی
تو صحیح نہیں

پورا قرآن اور حدیث سامنے رکھ کر ہی بات کی ہے، انسان فرار کے راستے ڈھونڈتا ہے اور شیطان ورغلاتا ہے. جہاں انگلی رکھنے کی جگہ ملی بے سر و پا امیدوں کے عقائد گھر لیے.

 

[Bret Hawk]

Re: A renowned scholar provoking people to attack Milaad events.

First of All
I am not Shia

Dr. Israr did a mistake by quoting a Hadith that have doubtfull due to many version(as he himself said). like he himself said that few version said that Imam was not Ali Razi Allah anhoo. then why to quote such hadith??

also When we have other narrations that did not have this incident at all in the books of Hadith about the same Ayath? then why to use such incident that have few doubts??

Since when you’ve become privy to the intentions and hidden motives of other individuals and in this case with regards to the predilections of the great Dr Israr Sahab? He quoted a Hadith from the Sahih Sitta collection of Tirmidhi and if you and others consider it to hold some dubious character that pertains to its authenticity then why do we (Including the Hadith critics and scholars as well) hold that collection in such high prestige and honour as compare to other reliable Hadith compendiums? We have to forsake these negative and hypocritical tendencies when it comes to our dealing of these branches of Islamic sciences. Either we should not term any other collection of work, which involves the efforts of mortal men, besides the holy message of Quran as infallible, the most authentic, complete and indisputable or else we have to become a hyper cynical sceptic in relation to these scholarly collections of Islamic sciences.

 

[atensari]

Re: A renowned scholar provoking people to attack Milaad events.

First of All
I am not Shia
Dr. Israr did a mistake by quoting a Hadith that have doubtfull due to many version(as he himself said). like he himself said that few version said that Imam was not Ali Razi Allah anhoo. then why to quote such hadith??

also When we have other narrations that did not have this incident at all in the books of Hadith about the same Ayath? then why to use such incident that have few doubts??

Different versions of a single event is not unusual, this happens very often, and it is not necessary that all Hadeeth are available in all books.

Quoting Hadeeth is not a mistake, the blunder is that a Hadeeth is presented as “Personal Statement of Dr Israr Ahmed” to promote vandalism.

 

[babadeena]

Mughal1,
Your post 187 continues. Dear look, we are still determining that what come into the "category" of "Mindoonallah"
In your post "MA" denotes "Anything", so how you r getting it only to "IDOLS". And I also much before
earlier pointed out to you that "restricting the verses at the time of that era" is what you are projecting.
Please apply them in the present era. For me the definition stands as is given in post No.189. and that
is cemented by proof from Quran.
Example:
A person wishes to give one Daig of food for Fee Sabilllah. He is in his home. and he
arranges it there and distributes it in the locality.
Or same person with this Daig goes to Data Darbar and says that I am distributing
it as Data de Nazar. Now I ask you is it Shirk or not Shirk. for me mere bringing this
idea into heart that if this daig will be distributed at x,yz place then it will be
more acceptable is even Shirk. Because my Lord is everywhere and is
not restricted to only in certain places, where people think that they offerings and
prayers are more heard or more acceptable.

 

[babadeena]

Re: A renowned scholar provoking people to attack Milaad events.

Different versions of a single event is not unusual, this happens very often, and it is not necessary that all Hadeeth are available in all books.

Quoting Hadeeth is not a mistake, the blunder is that a Hadeeth is presented as “Personal Statement of Dr Israr Ahmed” to promote vandalism.

Atensari!! Everyone has right to participate in any debate. But diverting the topic away which is Shirk
and making it a point of "authentcity of Hadith, it is or it is not and how it is how its not" is too much.
Will be appreciated if the discussion remains on the topic.

 

[atensari]

Re: A renowned scholar provoking people to attack Milaad events.

Atensari!! Everyone has right to participate in any debate. But diverting the topic away which is Shirk
and making it a point of "authentcity of Hadith, it is or it is not and how it is how its not" is too much.
Will be appreciated if the discussion remains on the topic.

I am responding to this post: http://www.siasat.pk/forum/showthre...k-(شرک-کیا-ہے)&p=294907&viewfull=1#post294907

 

[Mughal1]

Dear Mughal,

Please do not mix regular daily affairs which has nothing to do with barakah or blessing. For example if you kiss your child to show love and affection it is not SHIRK. But on the other hand if you kiss the hand or feet of your Peer NOT ONLY in love and affection, BUT with a believe of getting blessing or Barkah is SHIRK.

Now read the following Hadeeth agains Omer (رَّضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُمْ) kissed the black stone only because he (رَّضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُمْ) saw Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وسلم) kissing it. Do you think that a Sahabi-e-Rashul (رَّضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُمْ) of such caliber would even think of kissing anything else with the intention of getting blessing from that thing without seeing Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وسلم) doing the same act. This hadeeth shows how careful Sahabi-e-Rashul (رَّضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُمْ) were to avoid any involvement in SHIRK. While kissing, he (رَّضِيَ اللَّهُ عَنْهُمْ) provided the reasoning to the people around that why is he kissing the black stone. The message is very clear that he wanted people to avoid kissing something as religious ritual, not done by Prophet Muhammad (صلی اللہ علیہ وآلہ وسلم).

Narrated 'Abis bin Rabia: 'Umar came near the Black Stone and kissed it and said "No doubt, I know that you are a Stone and can neither benefit anyone nor harm anyone. Had I not seen Allah's Apostle kissing you I would not have kissed you." (Sahih Bukhari Book #26, Hadith #667)

Actions which comes under the category of SHIRK are such as hanging up amulets (وہ چھوٹا سا زیور جو نظر بد سے بچنے کے لیے پہنا جاۓ) or wearing a talisman (تعویذ) or string to dispel or ward off calamity (مصیبت دور کرنے کے لیے دھاگہ باندھنا), because everyone who attribute powers to a thing when Allaah has not made it so either according to sharee’ah or according to the laws of the universe, has associated something with Allaah. This also applies to one who touches a thing seeking its barakah (blessing), when Allaah has not created any barakah in it, such as kissing the doors of the mosques, touching their thresholds, seeking healing from their dust, and other such actions.

Dear pakistani, thank you for your views on shirk. You seem to be of similar views as babadeena.

The simple answer as far as definition of shirk goes is that in islam we have two fundamental concepts a)CREED/aqaaid and b)DEEDS/amaal. There is no other concept in islam.

When we talk about towheed or shirk or mulhidiyat etc, we are talking about creed not deeds.

So it is only and only your beliefs that decide your reliigion not your deeds. This is made clear in all books of aqaaid.

So please be rest assured that there is no such thing as shirk fil afaal or amaal in islam or quran.

This discussion is not about quran and islam but concept of shirk of some people like yourselves. I am trying to understand why you believe things this way when it is clearly not right way by any stretch of imagination.

You all fail to convince me that your definition of shirk is the right one. It is against any rule ever known to mankind. None has ever mixed up the dividing line between creeds and deeds or beliefs and practices or ideas and conducts. Your way of thinking defies logic and philosophy and rationality altogether.

Let me try and explain. Let say a man does not believe that a stone in his path is a god so he goes and kicks it out of the way. According to your idea he has kicked god. Why? Because some people believe stones are gods. It is because you people are telling me that beliefs and intentions do not matter just actions matter on their own. Now can you explain so that I could understand how this makes any sense whatsoever? What logioc is there? What rules are you people following?

You have filled page after page yet you fail very badly to explain your stance. Does that not tell you something as to what you are talking about is senseless?

My stance is very clear and to the point that beliefs and intentions matter as base upon which an actions is taken as worship or not worship. If I do not believe in a stone as my god then if I kick it, I am simply kicking a stone. However if I bleieve that the stone is my god then because the stone is god therefore now situation changes so if I kick the stone now that will be disrespecting my god.

If you people cannot understand such a very simple thing then I am clearly lost for words because when people leave no common ground to stand on then discussion has to be on common ground itself not the divisive issue.

So there is nothing common between us because you people are talking nonsensical by way of denying and defying rules of common sense that are foundational for humanity. If we do not have common standard of measuring anything how can we do any business with each other? This is utterly a chaotic situation.

So it is very clear that one of us is confused and we all can see who?

This is why kissing anything is not shirk unless one believes that one is kissing a god with intention of his worship. The other thing to note is how can one kiss allah? I mean you people are going from one absurdity to another.

So my brotherly advice to all people like you is, please start thinking for understanding things. Only if one understands things one can explain them to others and that is why you cannot explain them because there is no logic in your explanations that shows you yourselves have no real idea as to what you people reeally believe or what you are really talking about.

So get things worked out in yourselves first and then come and explain them to others, you will see you will have no problem telling them to others sensibly.

Believe me I feel silly telling you all this but only truth can set us free. I do not like being pedantic so please accept my apologies for sounding rude as I did not mean it this way.

my regards and best wishes.



[FONT=&amp][/FONT]Surah 16 AN-NAHL – The social structure and system

Proclaim in the name of Allah the Gracious, the Merciful.

1] That goal of peace is set by Allah for the benefit of mankind but you the people cannot hasten its accomplishment without support of each other. The sovereignty of the universe belongs to Him alone and His rule is far beyond the resistance of the rulers the ignorant people impose upon themselves.

2] He sends as the missionaries with the revelation of His program to any of the nations that needs it from among His servants so that they in turn alert the other nations that there is no ruler other than I so that they become consistent with My rule for the good of themselves as human community.

3] He alone has given rise to all the galaxies in the cosmos including this galaxy for the set purpose. As a sole ruler of this kingdom He is far beyond resistance of those whom ignorant people impose upon themselves as rulers.

4] He evolved man from a sperm and an ovum that come together and progress to a stage that he is able to clearly argue his standpoint.

5] And the cattle, he gave rise to them as well and for you in them are many benefits such as making things you wear or eat their meat and the like.

6] How pleasant they look and how happy they make you when you bring them home in the evening and drive them to pasture in the dusky morning.

7] They carry your heavy loads to far-off townships that you could not otherwise reach
without painful toil, that is how your Lord takes care of you through His blissful program.

8] He likewise brought about horses, mules and donkeys for you to ride and put on show and He is the evolver of things which are yet beyond your stage of knowledge.

9] That is how it is made obvious for you the proper way of life is that which leads to rule of Allah for the good of mankind and all other ways lead away from that way to harm and destruction of humanity. Had Allah planned other than freewill for you the mankind, He could have programmed you all to be united needing no revealed guidance.

10] It is He Who rains down water from the height so that you drink from it and with it He brings about greenery for pasturing of your cattle.

11] With it He also brings forth for you crops, olives, date-palms, grapes and every kind of fruit. Surely there is a proof in all this for those who observe these things with care.

12] He has subjected to your service the night and the day, the sun and the moon and likewise the stars also serve you due to His set out universal plan, surely therein are a variety of lessons for people who would learn to be sensible.

13] In the earth He has evolved things of different colours, surely there is a lesson in this for those who would observe and reflect.

14] It is He Who has subjected the sea to your service so that you may eat fresh meat therefrom and that you may bring out of it ornaments to wear. Moreover you see that ships plough their course through it. He has brought about all this so that you seek prosperity as per His program and thereby you become a human community that is worth the name.

15] He brought about highlands and lowlands on the earth so that you could live on the earth in case it does away with you and He also evolved rivers and roads, and so that you could find your way around He brought forth

16] landmarks and the stars for your guidance.

17] Is He Who has originated all this then like the one who cannot originate a thing, why don’t you reflect the implications of that for learn to understand things?

18] His provision is in such abundance that even if you decided to use all of the provisions of Allah, you will never be able to go through them all because Allah has secured all the needs and wants of mankind by way of His blissful program.

19] That is how Allah makes obvious your motives regarding each other regardless you expose them to each other yourselves or you try to hide them from each other by way of your own actions.

20] Those rulers other than Allah upon whom the ignorant ones rely have created nothing at all and even themselves have been propped up by their subjects.

21] They are themselves powerless having no control over their own lives, that is why they have no idea how the nations rise to power.

22] Be aware therefore that your ruler is only one and those who commit not to working for peace according to His set out end goal for mankind their minds refrain from learning about it out of their arrogance.

23] Allah surely makes obvious in time the truth behind whatever falsehood they promote as true and beneficial and whatever truth they try to cover up to inflict harm on mankind by the results of their own actions and that is because He does not approve those who try to influence mankind for the wrong reasons.

24] That is why if they are asked, what has been revealed by your Lord? They say, fictitious stories about the ancients.

25] It is for this reason they bear full responsibility for bringing about situations and circumstances whereby revolts in time becomes inevitable and that is why they bear responsibility for painful suffering and destruction of those whom they mislead due to their stupidity. Alas! How stressfully painful is the result of their such irresponsible behaviour.

26] Surely chiefs and priests of nations before them also conspired against Our program but Allah shook off their make belief based social systems, structures and practices to benefit themselves at the expense of their masses by the very foundation and the whole institution fell apart resulting in their own destruction crushing them under its own weight, that is how the results of their own actions came upon them from where they did not even suspect because they thought they had everything worked out and under control.

27] That is how on the day of uprising He leaves such people to face humiliation they bring upon themselves and people ask them, where are those rulers whom you assigned rulership in My kingdom instead of abiding by My rule concerning whom you used to wage wars on those whom we sent with Our guidance? Those who have been given the program as a mission say, today there is only gloom and doom for those who opposed Allah's guidance.

28] Those whom Our missionaries come to stop while they are inflicting harm and destruction upon their own people offer false justification to them saying, we are not doing anything wrong. They are replied, not at all rather Allah has made it obvious to us what you are doing even to your own people.

29) Now suffer the consequences by ending up in hell of your own making. In fact, terrible will be the state in which the influential people will find themselves in.

30] On the other hand when those who do what is proper are asked by others, what has been sent by your Lord? They say, that which is beneficial for us to better the world. Goodness is the result for actions of such people in this world and the state of existence yet to come will be even better. How splendid will be the state of existence of those who do what is proper.

31] Blissful kingdoms they will enter wherein will flow rivers of all things of their needs and desires. That is how Allah rewards such people as a result of their own actions,

32] Those whom Our missionaries come to rescue but find them doing good for their own people say, you have accomplished peace and security for yourselves therefore enter the blissful kingdom you have created for yourselves by your own hard work.

33) So are these opposers of Our program waiting for Our missionaries to come and rescue them from the situation they have got themselves into or are they waiting for the law of consequences as set by your Lord to come to pass? If they are waiting for consequences of their harmful and destructive actions against their own people then so did those who destroyed themselves before them. It was not Allah who inflicted them with injustice but that they themselves inflicted harm and destruction upon each other instead of living like good united human family.

34] That is how in the end the destructive results of their deeds overtook them by surprise and the very idea of uprising at which they mocked hemmed them in. That is how their environmental pot exploded when it reached beyond its boiling point.

35) Those who live by rules of others than Allah whom they impose upon themselves say, had Allah not destined us to abide by rule of any other than Him then neither we nor our forefathers would have done that nor we would have forbidden anything other than what he did. Such excuses were put forth also by those who perished before them. However responsibility upon Our messengers is only to convey Our message clearly.

36] No doubt We raised a messenger in every nation saying, serve the set out goal of Allah alone and let not the forces that lead away from His program take control of you. After making that clear Allah left people to guide themselves or be of those who face the results of their own harmful and destructive actions. So travel through the earth and see what was the end of those who denied each other their God given rights to provision thereby opposed Our program for them.

37] No matter how eager you may be for their guidance Allah does not guide those who choose to go their own way and that is why such people are beyond any help by anyone.

38] They swear by Allah their strongest oaths saying, Allah will never raise the down trodden people to dignified life? Nay, rather He will and it is a promise He has made binding upon Himself though most among the mankind do not learn His program to understand how He is going to do that.

39] He will fulfil His promise so that He demonstrates to them the truth of His program about which they dispute in order to make it obvious to the mankind that the opposers of His program are liars indeed.

40) As for raising down trodden to dignity, when We intend to do anything as per Our program, We need only initiate the process as Our expressed will and it comes about.

41] Therefore those who migrate mentally and physically for the program of Allah after suffering victimization at the hands of the rulers and the priests We will certainly bless them with a kingdom of their own so the reward to come could be much greater if they could realise it.

42] Such are the ones who face sensibly the ills inflicted upon them with steadfast courage and put their trust in the set out laws of their Lord working hard to change things for the better as per Our guidance.

43] Behold, We never sent any messengers to people before you but they were people full of courage whom We inspired with Our program. Ask those who strive hard to spread the message if you the people are not aware of it already.

44] We sent them with clear goals and guidelines as are in the Zaboor. Likewise We have sent to you the people this program so that you may explain it clearly to the rest of mankind as to what has been sent for them so that they may think it through thoroughly.

45] So do those who oppose Our program and conspire against it feel secure that Allah will not debase them as a result of their own harmful and destructive actions against each other or let them reach the painful suffering from the sources they do not even anticipate?

46] Or that He may catch them in some self created trouble in the course of their journey that leaves them no way for their escape?

47] Or that He may find them in trouble even after alerting them about the danger? By alerting you about all these dangers your Lord intends to benefit you by means of His blissful program for you.

48] Why don’t they observe things carefully which Allah has evolved as to how Allah secures them in their existence, purpose and function protecting them in every way against failure because they are subjected to laws set by of Allah which they follow faithfully.

49] That is how due to laws of Allah exists and functions all that is in the heavens and all that is in the earth from the least significant of the creatures to the most significant of the creatures and they do not disregard His set out laws.

50] They follow the course of action their Lord has set upon them to govern their behaviour and that is how they fulfil what they are programmed to do.

51] That is why Allah has advised that you the mankind should not live by two different standards by two different rulers because the truth is He alone is the one who has the right to sovereignty in this kingdom. Therefore it is fulfilling of My program alone that you should be concerned about.

52] Behold, to Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and the earth and to Him belongs the constitution for the benefit of the humanity that is lasting, will you then rather abide by rule of other than Allah?

53] Whatever blessings you enjoy are from Allah so when you are in trouble upon His laws you should rely for help to free yourselves.

54] Even though it is He alone who frees you from troubles yet no sooner you are relieved that some people from among you run to their self-imposed rulers instead of abiding by rule of their Lord

55] as if to show their contempt for the favours that We bestowed upon them. Please yourselves as you see fit but soon you will come to know the results of your make belief based actions against Our program.

56] They freely set aside a portion of what We have provided for them for their self imposed rulers and priests about whose tricks to rob them they know nothing. About the program of Allah! You the rulers and the priests will certainly be questioned as to lies you fabricate against it.

57] They will be questioned because they attribute the program of Allah with such baseless foundations of which His majesty is free because they go along with whatever comes to their minds.

58] It is because whenever the blissful program is announced to any of the nations’ ruling and priestly elite regarding the well being of the masses in the communities, the leadership becomes entangled in derailing its given sense of direction out of spite,

59] hiding its harmful and destructive motives from its people due to blissful program with which it is blessed, asking itself whether it should go along with it unwillingly or bury it in the dust. Beware! Destructive is the decision they make about the blissful program of Allah.

60] To those who do not commit to working for peace according to Our given guidelines for the better end goal applies the similitude of a people who harm and destroy themselves whereas example of people who follow blissful program of Allah is dignified because He is the ruler Who is full of wisdom.

61] If Allah were to let people with such harmful and destructive mindset and attitude face the results of their actions against His guidance instantly, He would not have left even a single one of them on the earth but He gave them respite for amending their ways within an appointed time period. So when their appointed time is over they can neither stay beyond that for a moment nor can they go a moment before it. When the pot of harm and destruction boils over it explodes taking away with it all those involved in it unless any repent and reform.

62] They attribute to Allah partners in His sovereignty by setting up themselves as rulers other than Him which they hate for themselves because they rather have all they can without sharing it with anyone that is how they attribute lies to themselves with their own tongues ensuring good thing in life for themselves. Let there be no doubt that by doing so the only thing they bring about for themselves is hell of hatred against themselves that consumes them before others.

63] By this testimony of Allah it is obvious that We sent messengers before you to other nations as well but their harmful and destructive leadership made their actions look good to them so they opposed Our program, such leadership is their role model even today so they are bound to end up in painful suffering.

64] We have not revealed this book to you but for the set purpose that you clearly explain to them everything over which they divide and go to wars. This book is a blissful program for the people who would commit to working for peace.

65] It is like the water that Allah sends down from the height whereby He gives life to the land after it has been dead likewise it brings about lively nations. Surely in this there is a lesson for those who would observe things to draw sense.

66] There is a lesson for you in cattle to think about. We give you to drink by means of processes that take place in their bodies between what they digest and the way it becomes blood and pure milk, pleasant for those who would drink it.

67] Likewise processes take place in the fruits of the date-palm and the grapes from which you derive drinks and wholesome food, certainly therein is a lesson to think about for those who would use their sense to learn and benefit.

68] The same is true in case of bees, your Lord programmed the bees to build their hives in elevated places, in the trees and in anything which people build for them.

69) Moreover partake of every kind of fruit and follow the smooth ways of your Lord. From the processes in its body comes forth a syrup of different colours that contains a healing property for mankind. Certainly in this there is a lesson for those who would think as to how it all exists, functions and fulfils its purpose.

70] Likewise Allah brings you about and thereafter He lets you fulfil your full potential and that is how He lets some of you the people live from birth till they grow old knowing nothing after having known much. That is why Allah makes known to you He has set up laws to govern all affairs.

71] That is because Allah gifts some of you more than others with abilities for production and distribution of things of need and desire for whole of the mankind. Yet some of those who have gathered more of the provision do not share it with those for whom they have been made responsible in case they become their equals in that respect. By doing so, are they not stifling progress and prosperity for mankind for which Allah bestowed His program?

72] That is the reason Allah raises supporters for you from your own kind and raises for you through your mates children and grandchildren whereby He provides you with provisions that are beneficial. Will they still continue working for rifts and wars between mankind on basis of their make beliefs thus keep the benefits of the blessing of Allah from reaching those having the rights from Allah to get them

73] and take on other rulers than Allah to serve them who have no power to provide them with anything for sustenance from the heavens and the earth nor can they ever have any power to do so?

74] Therefore invent not rivals of Allah. Allah makes all this obvious for you the mankind because otherwise you could not know.

75] Allah gives you an example of a person who is disabled (become old or sick etc) so he has no power to do anything for himself or others and a person whom We have given the ability to exploit beneficial provision from Us and he freely uses it to benefit personally as well as to benefit the community, should both of these be treated the same way or should the able one provide the needed care for the disabled? Remember, to decide such matters sovereignty only belongs to Allah alone yet most of them bother not to learn to understand things.

76] Allah gives you another example of two people, one of them is like a baby (or born disabled etc) and has no ability to do anything so he is a burden on his supporter and no matter what he cannot do anything to benefit himself. Should he be treated the same way as the one fully capable of looking after himself? This is why only such as command fair and compassionate treatment of each other are the one who are on the path that is proper and firmly fixed.

77] It is because Allah alone makes obvious what is to happen in the future in the kingdom of the heavens and the earth. If people refuse to live by rule of Allah then the occurrence of the moment of uprising will be automatic like the twinkling of an eye or things related to it because Allah has set up laws to govern affairs relating all things.

78] That is how Allah brought you forth from the wombs of your mothers knowing nothing but He gave you sense of hearing and sense of sight as well as intelligence so that you develop in to a human worth the name.

79] Do they not see the birds that wing their flight in the air towards the height, who holds them up but set laws of Allah by way of a set mechanism? Surely therein are lessons for people who would commit to working for peace.

80] So that Allah brings about for you through your set up institutions peaceful existence whereby He brings about for you bundles of blissful things for covering all your needs and wants so that you make period of your life journey easier through them for as long as you stay without diversion there from because without such cultivation life will be like a barren land so find ways to inherit things that make life worthwhile for a set period of time.

81] Allah has provided you with things for your safety and security out of what he has evolved. He has enabled you to make rooms for yourselves among influential people like you make resorts in the mountains and He has enabled you to make plans to cover yourselves from getting harmed just like you make garments to protect yourselves from temperature variations like you make coats of armour to protect yourselves during wars amongst yourselves. All because He wants to grant His blessings to you in full therefore you should become of those who commit to live in peace.

82] O messenger, if they still pay no due attention to your mission then grieve not because your duty is only to convey Our message clearly.

83] They should attain blessings of Allah in full by implementing His program but instead they are prevent this from happening because most of them oppose Our program for them.

84] Do they realize what will happen during the period of time when We will raise landslide support from every nation for Our program? Then the opposers of Our program the chiefs and the priests along with their supporters will not be able to put forward any proper justification for what they do nor will they be able to receive any personal favours in private from each other.

85] That is how at the time of uprising the undue exploiters of humanity will face the retribution by their victims, it will not be easy for them to go through with it nor will they be granted any delay or respite.

86] Moreover at the time when those who live by rule of other than that of Allah will see their self appointed rulers other than Allah they will say, our Lord! Here are the rulers we set up ourselves by whose laws we used to live our lives instead of Yours. At this their self appointed rulers will toss their statement back at them saying, you are liars!

87] They will openly submit to sovereignty of Allah that day because their self appointed rulers will leave them in utter chaos.

88] As for those who oppose and debar others from the roadmap of Allah, We will let them suffer the consequences of their action in form of suffering upon suffering till they give up their way of life or perish because they cause rifts and wars between mankind.

89] That is why in time We will raise landslide support for Our program against this harmful and destructive leadership of chiefs and priests from their own people everywhere and likewise We will raise you the people against your own community leadership because that is the reason We have sent for you the Quran to explain everything necessary in detail to all people as a guidance towards blissful program thereby a good news for those who would commit to this program that leads to peace.

90] Allah commands justice and compassion based fair dealing for all individuals and all nations with all the interdependent human community and He forbids all such ideas and actions by anyone against any other individual or community that bring gloom and doom on a person or a community, actions that cause harm and destruction to mankind out of lawless behaviour of people against each other. He admonishes you so that you may take heed and build the better world together like a good family.


See my next post below for rest of this surah

 

[Mughal1]

Mughal1,
Your post 187 continues. Dear look, we are still determining that what come into the "category" of "Mindoonallah"
In your post "MA" denotes "Anything", so how you r getting it only to "IDOLS". And I also much before
earlier pointed out to you that "restricting the verses at the time of that era" is what you are projecting.
Please apply them in the present era. For me the definition stands as is given in post No.189. and that
is cemented by proof from Quran.
Example:
A person wishes to give one Daig of food for Fee Sabilllah. He is in his home. and he
arranges it there and distributes it in the locality.
Or same person with this Daig goes to Data Darbar and says that I am distributing
it as Data de Nazar. Now I ask you is it Shirk or not Shirk. for me mere bringing this
idea into heart that if this daig will be distributed at x,yz place then it will be
more acceptable is even Shirk. Because my Lord is everywhere and is
not restricted to only in certain places, where people think that they offerings and
prayers are more heard or more acceptable.

Thank you brother, but I state the verse again that says that all mindoonillah will end up in hell along their worshippers. I also gave links to other explanations and they agree that mindoonillah means idols that polytheists worship as gods. They too exclude godly persons eg prophets, angels etc.

I also made the point that people who believe jesus is god or his son are not called mushrik but kafir in all the relevant verses in the quran.

Allah defends his people against accusations of their worshippers instead of telling us look I am going to throw all of you in hell to show you I am god. Instead when it comes to that allah excludes his folks from thenlist of those bound for hell. These are very stange patterns in the quran and they must have reason to be so, don't you think so? It is on this basis I am excluding godly from the list of mindoonillah or there is definiley a contradiction in the quran as the link given above shows.

So you need to clarify your stance on why you think all who are worshipped as gods are mindoonillah and how can then be excluding from the list of those bound for hell fire? Don't you think that removing contradictory interpretation is more importan than what you suggest?

This is my original reason for asking you that you need to explain your stance on definition of shirk bewcause I already done that for my stance.

There is no point in talking about daigs and kissing and calling as separate issues rathe rthey are all bundle of same problem ie your strange definition of shirk that has no bounds.

I suggest that you state your definition of shirk and clarify it clearly that should solve all shirk related problems otherwise we can talk till cows come home and we will still be here going round and round in circles.

Creed=set of beliefs not set of actions. For actions to have any meaning beliefs must be in place and intentions must be there. THis is where you are making serious mistakes. You are trying to turn things up side down which is absurd and impossible to do and none has been able to do it.

You are accusing people of committing shirk because they do certain things rather than trying to understand what they believe and therefore do what they do with those intentions in their heads. You do not accept their reason you are trying to impose your reason on them.

Would you like me to call you a mushrik when you are passing by a mandir, accusing you for being their because you wanted to worship the idols? Of course you would hate me doing that so please realise that you have no ground to stand on.

You can never prove no matter what merely from the actions alone disregarding beliefs and intentions that people are doing shirk. The whole humanity believes things this way ie if you believe in islamic creed then and only then you are a muslim regardless you perform any deeds are not.

Try and understand that shirk is sin but not all sins are necessarily shirk. Shirk is kufar but not all kufar is shirk. Beliefs are beliefs and deeds are deeds. No matter what you cannot mix them or you confuse yourself and confuse others. Absurdities have no bounds.

My brotherly advice for you and others like you wil be to stop talkingand start thinking and putting things togethjer and do not stop till all pieces of jigsaw fit together nicely. So have good rest and waste not your time in condemning others because of your wrong understanding of definition of shirk. Try to be as logical as possible. Let things flow naturally and see what happens.

I hope this helps you towards proper understanding of islam and quran ie accept commonly accepted defintions of terms stop redifining already well defined things against the rest of humanity. Otherwise you will be on your own speaking only to yourself for creationg your independent language differernt from the rest.

So try and accept the rules and interpret the quran according to commonly accepted rules rather than trying to break the rules and distort the quran thereby ending up with total absurdity and nonsense.

Daigs and chaawals only matter when we sit together as a happy family, because creating senseless divisions where there are none is a bad way to go. May allah forgive you and me both and guide us to the right path.

Wa maa alaina ilal balaagh.

regards and all the best.





Rest of Surah 16

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91] Therefore fulfil the constitutional obligations of Allah as you have agreed to abide by them and breach not the agreements regarding each other after you have agreed to uphold them because you have put your trust in goals and guidelines of Allah and Allah makes results of all that you do evident for all to see.

92] Do not be like a gathering of people that talks people into forming a strong network of community but then lets it disintegrate itself into fragments through make beliefs thereby negligence of obligations towards each other. Therefore take not your mutual agreements as means for deceiving each other so that one party may take undue advantage of the other because Allah bids you to put effort in fulfilling your responsibility. Otherwise on the day of uprising He will certainly make evident the results of your actions in form of rifts and divisions.

93] Had it served plan of Allah He could have gathered all of you all into one nation but He lets stray whoever so chooses and He guides whoever make effort to attain it. However you will certainly be made to face the results of all that you do.

94] So never enter agreements to deceive each other so that you do not end up back into chaos after being firmly fixed on the foundation of Our program and taste the harm and destruction as a result of your actions for not doing what is good for mankind and debarring others from the program of Allah thereby ending up in hell of your own making.

95] Do not exchange the program of Allah that is good for the whole human community for your personal gains at the expense of rest of your humanity. Certainly result of your united actions based on program of Allah is much more beneficial than your personal gain for your individual selves if you could learn to understand this.

96] Whatever is your personal gain for yourself as an individual at the expense of the community will be lost but whatever you gain according to program of Allah for the good of the mankind will last. We will certainly reward those who are hard working and courageous according to the noblest of their deeds as per Our program.

97] Whoever does anything that is good for the mankind whether the leadership or the supporting masses provided the party is doing it out of commitment to peace We will surely grant such a people new life, a life that is worth living and that is how We will reward such people according to the best of their deeds.

98] Therefore when you read The Quran read it for seeking the life of peace and security for mankind through guidance of Allah in order to ensure protection for the masses against the conspiracies of the harmful and destructive leadership that tries to take away people from the path of Allah.

99] Surely the harmful and destructive leadership has no power over those who commit to working for peace because they put their trust in universal laws of their Lord.

100] It has power only over those who let it take over them and they are those who commit to live by rule of others than Allah.

101] That is why when We let a people free of its influence change one standard for living with a better standard that Allah makes obvious for mankind through that which He has revealed they say to them, you people are just lying. But the fact is most of them do not bother to learn to find out which standard is good or bad for them or why.

102] Say, this standard has been sent for freeing humanity from harm and destruction by your Lord as a set purpose to give solid foundation to those committed to working for peace through this guidance as well as a manifesto of prosperity for those who would commit themselves to working for peace in future.

103] We should also make obvious for people what the opponents say about Our program that it is a teaching by an ordinary human being. However the ordinary human being they attribute this to can never put together words in such a uniquely structured and uniquely distinct way whereas this message is in a language uniquely structured and uniquely distinct demonstrably beyond human creation.

104] Yet after having all this information those who still fail to commit to working for peace according to guidelines of Allah, He does not enforce His program upon them so they are left to their own choices to end up in painful suffering.

105] The fact is, those who do not commit to working for peace according to guidelines of Allah it is they who invent harmful and destructive ideologies, system, structures and practices because they are the ones who deny Our set out rights to others regarding Our provisions for them.

106] Because who can work against guidelines of Allah after really committing to working for peace unless one is forced the while his mind remains committed to working for peace? That is because any people who willingly open up to working against guidelines of Allah will move away from blissful program of Allah so they will end up in terrible suffering.

107] This is because such people love short term personal gains at the expense of long term gains for the human community therefore Allah guides not such people as work against His mission.

108] These are the ones whose faculties of thinking and whose abilities of heeding disciplines and whose capabilities of being able to see things for what they really are Allah finds untapped yet they themselves are neglectful of the consequences for their such behaviour.

109] There is no doubt that if they continue neglecting the use of their abilities this way then they will end up in an irreversible loss.

110] It is because your Lord only supports people who are constantly on the move ideologically or physically or both the ways after they go through hard work that is why they struggle through steadfastly and that is how your Lord thereby leads them to security by means of His program for blissful life for them.

111] During that period of time every person will only demand what one needs for oneself and everyone will be given the task whatever one can do and none of the people will be put through hardship of forced labour in vain.

112] Allah points out to you as an example a township which enjoyed peace and prosperity receiving its provisions in abundance from everywhere in every way yet in time it ended up neglecting its progress according to blissful program of Allah and as result Allah made its residents taste the consequences of their own doings and that is how they ended up in poverty and thereby insecurity.

113] A messenger was sent to them from among themselves but they denied him so they were found caught up in terrible painful suffering because they inflicting harm and destruction upon each other.

114] Therefore remember this and participate only in lawful things that Allah has provided you with for the good of the mankind, that is how by proper use of blissful program of Allah you should show each other that you have become a worthy people if you really claim to abide by rule of His Majesty.

115] ) He has surely strictly forbidden for you the followers of the Quran getting involved in things like ill-gotten gains/destruction, bloodshed, pig-philosophy, exploitation or greed based economy and all that is done outside the constitution of Allah. In case one is dragged into such a chaotic situation or circumstance whereby one is forced to get involved in such things but commits to getting out of this situation and means no harm to others nor rebellion against Our rule upon such people there is no blame because Allah is surely protector of mankind through His blissful program.

116] So you should never declare with your tongues falsely that this is lawful and that is unlawful in order to attribute false things to Allah because those who attribute falsehood to Allah will never prosper.

117] Short lived will be their joy because in time they will end up in painful suffering.

118] To the Jews We forbade things which We have already told you about and it were not We who imposed the nonsense hardships upon them but they imposed those hardships upon themselves out of their own make beliefs due to ignorance and arrogance.

119] That is because your Lord is surely with those who do anything wrong out of ignorance and then turn to His program after that and mend themselves in accordance to that, your Lord is there for them even after that in order to protect them through His blissful program.

120] Such a people were community of Abraham indeed, an upright nation because it was not of those like nations who abide by rule of any other than Allah.

121] It always used blissful program of Allah properly that is why He chose it as an example to point it out for others because He guided it to the path that is straight and firmly founded.

122 ] We gave it a good life in this world because till the end it remained of those who mend rifts and defects according to Our guidelines properly.

123] And now We have revealed to you the people Our will saying, follow the way of Abraham the upright one, he was not of those who live by rules of others than Allah.

124] As for staying put, it was ordained for those who differed about it. That is why your Lord decided the matter between them about which they fought over at the time of their uprising against each other.

125] Therefore invite people to the way of your Lord through rules of wisdom and advice that is beneficial for them, so reason with them in the most courteous manner because that is how your Lord will make obvious who has strayed from His program and so that He makes obvious who is abiding by His guidance.

126] That is how you should pursue people to win them over to your ideology as they pursue you to win you over to their ideology that is how you should show courage and wisdom and be top most of those with courage and wisdom.

127] So show courage because your confidence cannot be but due to wisdom of Allah, so worry not about them and distress not yourself due to their plots and tricks,

128] for Allah is with those who remain consistent with His program such as do good for humanity.