Allama Ghulam Ahmad Parwez's threads collections

[Abdul Allah]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

5:69, 2:62 aur 7:159 main jo bhi likha hai tum beshak os ko na mano. I don't care. Khuda ko bhi koi perwa nahi ho gi. Lakin jab bhi tum log apni ghalat interpretations ki waja se doosri nations k logon se koi bhi ziad.ti karo gy ... I and ppl like me will not support you .... Rather we will stop your hands...!!!

ANd


Don't try to mix irrelevant things. 3:85 main on logon ki baat ho rahi hai jo pehle se Muslim hain aur phir Kisi doosre deen ki taraf matwajja hote hain. Read 3:85 along with 3:86 to fully understand it:

[SIZE=5.2][FONT=PDMS_IslamicFont]اور جو شخص اسلام کے سوا کِسی دوسرے دین کو طلب کرے گا تو وہ اس سے مقبول نہ ہوگا اور وہ آخرت میں تباہ کاروں میں سے ہوگا۔ (۸۵) [/FONT][/SIZE][SIZE=5.2][FONT=PDMS_IslamicFont]الله تعالیٰ ایسے لوگوں کو کیسے ہدایت کرینگے جو کافر ہوگئے بعد اپنے ایمان لانے کے اور بعد اپنے اقرار کے کہ رسُول سچے ہیں اور (بعد اس کے کہ) ان کو واضح دلائل پہونچ چکے تھے اور الله تعالیٰ ایسے بےڈھنگے لوگوں کو ہدایت نہیں کرتے ۔ (۸۶) [/FONT][/SIZE]​

(81. And (remember) when Allah took the covenant of the Prophets, saying: "Take whatever I gave you from the Book and Hikmah, and afterwards there will come to you a Messenger confirming what is with you; you must, then, believe in him and help him.'' Allah said: "Do you agree (to it) and will you take up Isri'' They said: "We agree.'' He said: "Then bear witness; and I am with you among the witnesses.'') (82. Then whoever turns away after this, they are the rebellious.)(83. Do they seek other than the religion of Allah, while to Him submitted all creatures in the heavens and the earth, willingly or unwillingly. And to Him shall they all be returned.) (84. Say: "We believe in Allah and in what has been sent down to us, and what was sent down to Ibrahim, Isma`il, Ishaq, Ya`qub and Al-Asbat, and what was given to Musa, `Isa and the Prophets from their Lord. We make no distinction between one another among them and to Him (Allah) we have submitted.'') (85. And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers.)



Read from 81 and you will know that it is for All human beings and All Umat of All Prophets

 

[Abdul Allah]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

issi ayyet ko achi tarah samajh lo tum ko 2:62 aur 5:69 ki bhi samajh aa jaye gi. iss ayyet main number of conditions ziada hain. iss ayyet main rewards bhi ziada hain aur positive rewards hain (gardens and rivers underneath).

5:69, 2:62 main siraf basic necessary conditions hain. Reward bhi siraf relief in fear and grief hai. Ye reward positive nahi hai siraf relaxation in negative things hai.

Secondly ...5:12 k end main jo "astray from right path" ka zikar hai wo 'kufar' karne walon k liye hai. 'Kufar' main 'basic conditions' (as mentioned in 2:62,5;69) ki violation bhi shamil ho jaati hai.

Lehaza 5:12 is also in no conflict with 2:62,5;69

'Kufar' main 'basic conditions' (as mentioned in 2:62,5;69) ki violation bhi shamil ho jaati hai.


BHI Shamil hain yes and is main Atat e rasool Bhi shamil hy so jo Atat e Rasool SW nai kary ga un k anay k baad wo "astray from right path" hain aur "astray from right path" can not lead to Janaat.

And Agali Ayat bhi parh lain??

(13. So, because of their breach of their covenant, We cursed them and made their hearts grow hard. They changed the words from their (right) places and have abandoned a good part of the Message that was sent to them. And you will not cease to discover deceit in them, except a few of them. But forgive them and overlook (their misdeeds). Verily, Allah loves the doers of good.)

Jinhoon ny Wada pura nahi kia un par Allah ny ***** (Curse) ki hy and you are saying k Wo Greif or Gham sy nijat yafta hain. Jis par Allah ki ***** ho wo Gham sy Nijat yafta hoga??

Un main sy bohat kum hain jinhoon ny Wada pura kia Aur jinhoon ny Wada pura nahi kia unko Hum kuch nahi kahain gay (Is Ayat ki had tak) Magar Allah ny We cursed them K zaraye un par ***** Curse kia hy aur jis par Allah ki ***** ho wo Gham sy nijat yafta kiasy ho sakta hy??


Note: I never say k In Ayat main conflict hy.

Main ny hamesha kaha k 2:62,5;69 main wo log shamil hain jinhoon ny Wada pura kia ya wo log jin tak pegham pohanca hi nahi.

 

[Abdul Allah]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

@Abdul Allah

Tum jo bhi kar rahe ho ... agar debate 'win' bhi karte ho tu yahi matlab nikle ga k there are contradictions in Quran. Aqal nahi istimaal kar sakte then at least sharam he kar lo...!!!

Bhai Khuda k liye Main debate win karny ko nahi Ap(Dosroon ko) ko Samjhany ko post karta hoon

Aur ya contradictions nahi hain

2:62,5;69 main wo log hain jin tak pegham nahi pohanca ya wo jinhon ny wada pura kia. ya baat 5:12-13 (aur baki bohat si ayat parh kar) aik aam sy bachay ko bhi samjh a sakti hy.


Kyn k Wada pura na krny ka gunaha un par hi ho ga jin tak Rasool Allah sw ki nabowat ka pegham puhancha jin tak nahi pohancha wo us wakt tak fear sy nijat yafta thy magar jub pohanca gaya ub wo 5:12-13 main atay hain gar wo pegham milnay par wada pura karain tu theek warna Allah ny un par Curse kia hya. aur jis par Allah ka curse ho wo nijat yafta gham sy bari nahi ho sakta..

 

[Abdul Allah]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

Dear brother please start realising that human error is impossible to eliminate. The best we can do is get to know the rules or formulas and apply them the best we can and leave rest to Allah. We are not expected to be Gods. So long as we do our best that is all Allah wants from us. He is well aware of what he has created. This is why he introduces himself as gracious and merciful.

If you are having difficulty accepting this then the best course of action will be to find a way whereby we could understand the quran error free. Error on our part does not means there is anything wrong with the quran. The quran itself states man has been created in a simple state to develop and improve himself. Man has been created knowing nothing at all. So if one is created knowing nothing at all then obviously he is going to go through a lot of trial error exercises through out his life.

regards and all the best.

Yes Human is to error.

But intentional errors are not errors that are crimes?

Changing Quran meaning just because someone small human brain could not understand it . is a crime.

if a person become rigid and did not change his mind but try to change quran? is it a simple error for you?

 

[iceburg]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

(81. And (remember) when Allah took the covenant of the Prophets, saying: "Take whatever I gave you from the Book and Hikmah, and afterwards there will come to you a Messenger confirming what is with you; you must, then, believe in him and help him.'' Allah said: "Do you agree (to it) and will you take up Isri'' They said: "We agree.'' He said: "Then bear witness; and I am with you among the witnesses.'') (82. Then whoever turns away after this, they are the rebellious.)(83. Do they seek other than the religion of Allah, while to Him submitted all creatures in the heavens and the earth, willingly or unwillingly. And to Him shall they all be returned.) (84. Say: "We believe in Allah and in what has been sent down to us, and what was sent down to Ibrahim, Isma`il, Ishaq, Ya`qub and Al-Asbat, and what was given to Musa, `Isa and the Prophets from their Lord. We make no distinction between one another among them and to Him (Allah) we have submitted.'') (85. And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers.)



Read from 81 and you will know that it is for All human beings and All Umat of All Prophets

81 main "Prophets" k covenant ki baat ho rahi hai ... that is separate issue. aur abhi bhi tum ne siraf 85 tak translation quote kiya hai. 86 ko chuppa gaye ho. 'losers' ki complete sense 86 se banti hai. Jo k pehle he Muslims hain aur os k baad kisi aur deen ki taraf mattwajja hote hain. secondly iss ayyet se ya bhi prove hota hai k "Murtadd" ki saza maut nahi hai balke "to be loser in hereinafter" hona hai.

 

[iceburg]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

'Kufar' main 'basic conditions' (as mentioned in 2:62,5;69) ki violation bhi shamil ho jaati hai.


BHI Shamil hain yes and is main Atat e rasool Bhi shamil hy so jo Atat e Rasool SW nai kary ga un k anay k baad wo "astray from right path" hain aur "astray from right path" can not lead to Janaat.

Attat-Rasool is advanced condition. It is like World Cup Final. Basic conditions wohi hain jo 2:62/5:69 main hain. Basic conditions se basic rewards milna shuru ho jaate hain ... as per 2:62,5:69

And Agali Ayat bhi parh lain??

(13. So, because of their breach of their covenant, We cursed them and made their hearts grow hard. They changed the words from their (right) places and have abandoned a good part of the Message that was sent to them. And you will not cease to discover deceit in them, except a few of them. But forgive them and overlook (their misdeeds). Verily, Allah loves the doers of good.)

Jinhoon ny Wada pura nahi kia un par Allah ny ***** (Curse) ki hy and you are saying k Wo Greif or Gham sy nijat yafta hain. Jis par Allah ki ***** ho wo Gham sy Nijat yafta hoga??

Un main sy bohat kum hain jinhoon ny Wada pura kia Aur jinhoon ny Wada pura nahi kia unko Hum kuch nahi kahain gay (Is Ayat ki had tak) Magar Allah ny We cursed them K zaraye un par ***** Curse kia hy aur jis par Allah ki ***** ho wo Gham sy nijat yafta kiasy ho sakta hy??


Note: I never say k In Ayat main conflict hy.

Main ny hamesha kaha k 2:62,5;69 main wo log shamil hain jinhoon ny Wada pura kia ya wo log jin tak pegham pohanca hi nahi.

ab tum kya karo gy...??? 5:69 aur 2:62 ko edit karo gy...???

bhai mere ye osi "kufar" ki explanation hai. ehd main Nimaz parhna bhi tha aur zakawt dena bhi tha waghaira...

5:69/2:62 wale wo log hain jo basic conditions ko abhi bhi meet karte hain.

issi ayyet main thorra aur aage jao ... tum ko pata chal jaye ga k Khuda 5:69/2:62 ko yahan bhoola hua nahi hai...

[FONT=PDMS_IslamicFont] بجز ان میں کے معدودے چند شخصوں کے سو آپ ان کو معاف کردیجئیے اور ان سے درگزر کیجئیے۔
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[iceburg]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

Bhai Khuda k liye Main debate win karny ko nahi Ap(Dosroon ko) ko Samjhany ko post karta hoon

Aur ya contradictions nahi hain

2:62,5;69 main wo log hain jin tak pegham nahi pohanca ya wo jinhon ny wada pura kia. ya baat 5:12-13 (aur baki bohat si ayat parh kar) aik aam sy bachay ko bhi samjh a sakti hy.


Kyn k Wada pura na krny ka gunaha un par hi ho ga jin tak Rasool Allah sw ki nabowat ka pegham puhancha jin tak nahi pohancha wo us wakt tak fear sy nijat yafta thy magar jub pohanca gaya ub wo 5:12-13 main atay hain gar wo pegham milnay par wada pura karain tu theek warna Allah ny un par Curse kia hya. aur jis par Allah ka curse ho wo nijat yafta gham sy bari nahi ho sakta..

quran main aisa kuch nahi likha k on tak pegham nahi pohuncha. this is like a new condition introduced by you. 2:62 main even Muslims k sath Chiristians/jews ka zikar hai. Mean they may live side by side. they have to fulfill basic conditions. And they will be free of grief and fear.

 

[Abdul Allah]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

81 main "Prophets" k covenant ki baat ho rahi hai ... that is separate issue. aur abhi bhi tum ne siraf 85 tak translation quote kiya hai. 86 ko chuppa gaye ho. 'losers' ki complete sense 86 se banti hai. Jo k pehle he Muslims hain aur os k baad kisi aur deen ki taraf mattwajja hote hain. secondly iss ayyet se ya bhi prove hota hai k "Murtadd" ki saza maut nahi hai balke "to be loser in hereinafter" hona hai.

Prophets ka Convent unki Umat par lago nahi hoga??

86 ko chupa gaya ?? are you in your senses ???

86 81 ki continuity hy 86 sy pahly 81-85 ata hy. and us main tamam Prophets ki umatain shamil ho gai.

 

[Abdul Allah]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

quran main aisa kuch nahi likha k on tak pegham nahi pohuncha. this is like a new condition introduced by you. 2:62 main even Muslims k sath Chiristians/jews ka zikar hai. Mean they may live side by side. they have to fulfill basic conditions. And they will be free of grief and fear.

It is not a new condition it is mentioned in 5:12

and tell me jinhoon ny wada pura nai kia un par Allah ki ***** hy. as per 5:12

Tu Tell me clearly

jin par Allah ki ***** hy kaya wo free of grief and fear hain.

 

[Abdul Allah]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

Attat-Rasool is advanced condition. It is like World Cup Final. Basic conditions wohi hain jo 2:62/5:69 main hain. Basic conditions se basic rewards milna shuru ho jaate hain ... as per 2:62,5:69



ab tum kya karo gy...??? 5:69 aur 2:62 ko edit karo gy...???

bhai mere ye osi "kufar" ki explanation hai. ehd main Nimaz parhna bhi tha aur zakawt dena bhi tha waghaira...

5:69/2:62 wale wo log hain jo basic conditions ko abhi bhi meet karte hain.

issi ayyet main thorra aur aage jao ... tum ko pata chal jaye ga k Khuda 5:69/2:62 ko yahan bhoola hua nahi hai...

[FONT=PDMS_IslamicFont] بجز ان میں کے معدودے چند شخصوں کے سو آپ ان کو معاف کردیجئیے اور ان سے درگزر کیجئیے۔
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Allah ki ***** ka parhny k baad ab tum kaya karoo gy??

Jin logo ny Wada pura nai kia un par Allah ki ***** hy as per 5:12

Kaya jin par Allah ***** hy wo fear and grief sy fear hain.



Y main ny pahly he mention kar dia tha ayat k hawal sy k Chand k siwa sub ny wada pura nai kia.
Aur wo chand jinhoon ny wada pura kia. Wo wada kia tha Allah k Messengers per eman lana. Tu agar ap unchand logon ko 2:62 ka part manty ho tu bhai problem kaya rah gai. ?? kyn k jinhoon ny Wada pura kia messenger ko man ny ka wo tu nijat yafta hay heen.




Aur dont forget to answer that

Jin par Allah ki ***** hy kaya wo Fear and Grief sy free hain??

 

[iceburg]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

Allah ki ***** ka parhny k baad ab tum kaya karoo gy??

Jin logo ny Wada pura nai kia un par Allah ki ***** hy as per 5:12

Kaya jin par Allah ***** hy wo fear and grief sy fear hain.



Y main ny pahly he mention kar dia tha ayat k hawal sy k Chand k siwa sub ny wada pura nai kia.
Aur wo chand jinhoon ny wada pura kia. Wo wada kia tha Allah k Messengers per eman lana. Tu agar ap unchand logon ko 2:62 ka part manty ho tu bhai problem kaya rah gai. ?? kyn k jinhoon ny Wada pura kia messenger ko man ny ka wo tu nijat yafta hay heen.




Aur dont forget to answer that

Jin par Allah ki ***** hy kaya wo Fear and Grief sy free hain??

Wo chand Muslims nahi hain.... ye wohi Christians/Jews hain jin ka zikar 5:69/2:62 main hai.

Ye Muslims iss liye nahi hain becuase Peghamber ne inn se dar guzar karna hai.... Muslims se dar Guzar karne ki kya zaroorat...??? aur Muslims tu wo hain jinhon ne poora wada poora kiya hai.

[FONT=PDMS_IslamicFont]بجز ان میں کے معدودے چند شخصوں کے سو آپ ان کو معاف کردیجئیے اور ان سے درگزر کیجئیے۔
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Lehaza I also request you k muaf kar do on becharon ko. On ki koi ada Khuda ko passand hai. Agar wo Peghamber pe eman nahi bhi laate phir bhi on se wada hai k they will be free of grief and fear. Aur Peghamber (PBUH) ko bhi Khuda ki safarash yahi hai k on ko Muaf kiya jaye aur on se dar guzar kiya jaye.

Tum koi self sufficient Khudayi Jillad ban.ne ki koshish na karo k Khuda muaf karne ka kahe lakin tum phir bhi saza do. Wase bhi tum saza de bhi nahi sakte. Tumhare ikhtiyar main nahi hai. pata nahi kis barte pe uchal rahe ho

 

[iceburg]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

Prophets ka Convent unki Umat par lago nahi hoga??

86 ko chupa gaya ?? are you in your senses ???

86 81 ki continuity hy 86 sy pahly 81-85 ata hy. and us main tamam Prophets ki umatain shamil ho gai.

Ummat-e-Muslim bhi shamil ho gi aur jo bhi next Prophets aayein gy on ki maddad karna hum sab ka farz hai.. Wada kiya hua hai hamare peghamber ne bhi

 

[Mughal1]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

Yes Human is to error.

But intentional errors are not errors that are crimes?

Changing Quran meaning just because someone small human brain could not understand it . is a crime.

if a person become rigid and did not change his mind but try to change quran? is it a simple error for you?

Dear brother Abdullah, looks like I have come right round full circle the while you are still standing on the same spot where we met at the start.

This means we are not on the same wave length because I take reason as basis for my arguments and you are taking your make beliefs as your basis for your arguments.

The division is clear and therefore I leave it to you to decide for yourself whether you should continue being unreasonable or change you stance. I will make one thing clear though that if you leave reason aside then talking about proof and proving is just a nonsense because proof and proving is inherently based upon reasoning and evidence. Make beliefs are make beliefs which can never be proven true because they are unreasonable and nothing to do with reasoning and evidence. I can only wish you all the best till you enable yourself to realise what I have explained.

May Allah have mercy on all of us and show us all what is true and good for the mankind.

 

[Abdul Allah]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

Wo chand Muslims nahi hain.... ye wohi Christians/Jews hain jin ka zikar 5:69/2:62 main hai.

Ye Muslims iss liye nahi hain becuase Peghamber ne inn se dar guzar karna hai.... Muslims se dar Guzar karne ki kya zaroorat...??? aur Muslims tu wo hain jinhon ne poora wada poora kiya hai.

[FONT=PDMS_IslamicFont]بجز ان میں کے معدودے چند شخصوں کے سو آپ ان کو معاف کردیجئیے اور ان سے درگزر کیجئیے۔
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Lehaza I also request you k muaf kar do on becharon ko. On ki koi ada Khuda ko passand hai. Agar wo Peghamber pe eman nahi bhi laate phir bhi on se wada hai k they will be free of grief and fear. Aur Peghamber (PBUH) ko bhi Khuda ki safarash yahi hai k on ko Muaf kiya jaye aur on se dar guzar kiya jaye.

Tum koi self sufficient Khudayi Jillad ban.ne ki koshish na karo k Khuda muaf karne ka kahe lakin tum phir bhi saza do. Wase bhi tum saza de bhi nahi sakte. Tumhare ikhtiyar main nahi hai. pata nahi kis barte pe uchal rahe ho

Main ny pahly he kah dia k unko Hum kuch nai kah sakthy as per this Ayath

but Allah ki ***** curse hy on per.


Khuda k liye Allah ki Ayat parh kar bhi Allah par bohtan mat bandhoon

Peghamber par eman lanay ka wada liye and
Allah kah raha hy k Wada pura na karny waloon par Allah ki ***** and curse hy and tum kah rahy ho k wo free of grief and fear hain.


Tel me clearly

Jin par Allah ki ***** and curse hy kaya wo wo free of greif and fear hain?? kaya jin par Allah ki ***** and curse hy kaya wo Janat main dakhil hoon gy??

 

[Abdul Allah]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

Ummat-e-Muslim bhi shamil ho gi aur jo bhi next Prophets aayein gy on ki maddad karna hum sab ka farz hai.. Wada kiya hua hai hamare peghamber ne bhi

Ayat main Aik prophet ke baat ho rahi na k Prophets.


and You just answer


Jin par Allah ny ***** and curse kia kaya wo free of grief hain.

 

[Abdul Allah]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

Dear brother Abdullah, looks like I have come right round full circle the while you are still standing on the same spot where we met at the start.

This means we are not on the same wave length because I take reason as basis for my arguments and you are taking your make beliefs as your basis for your arguments.

The division is clear and therefore I leave it to you to decide for yourself whether you should continue being unreasonable or change you stance. I will make one thing clear though that if you leave reason aside then talking about proof and proving is just a nonsense because proof and proving is inherently based upon reasoning and evidence. Make beliefs are make beliefs which can never be proven true because they are unreasonable and nothing to do with reasoning and evidence. I can only wish you all the best till you enable yourself to realise what I have explained.

May Allah have mercy on all of us and show us all what is true and good for the mankind.

you have not answer
answer please

Should we build reasoning on the basis of Quran or change Quran as per our reasoning.


as per your way of understanding and reasoning

it will


A man said Apple is red


now a color blind person who can not see red color and it he saw red as gray just because he can not see the red and can not prove it. start using his reasoning to prove that here the man want to say that Apple is GRAY.

 

[iceburg]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

Main ny pahly he kah dia k unko Hum kuch nai kah sakthy as per this Ayath

but Allah ki ***** curse hy on per.


Khuda k liye Allah ki Ayat parh kar bhi Allah par bohtan mat bandhoon

Peghamber par eman lanay ka wada liye and
Allah kah raha hy k Wada pura na karny waloon par Allah ki ***** and curse hy and tum kah rahy ho k wo free of grief and fear hain.


Tel me clearly

Jin par Allah ki ***** and curse hy kaya wo wo free of greif and fear hain?? kaya jin par Allah ki ***** and curse hy kaya wo Janat main dakhil hoon gy??

Jin per curse hai wo inn k illawa hain ... so you don't be silly.....

 

[iceburg]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

Ayat main Aik prophet ke baat ho rahi na k Prophets.


and You just answer




Jin par Allah ny ***** and curse kia kaya wo free of grief hain.

Just see my last post...

 

[Abdul Allah]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

Jin per curse hai wo inn k illawa hain ... so you don't be silly.....

Allah ny wada liya k Messengers par eman lao

Allah ny kaha jinhoon ny wada pura nahi kia un par Allah ka Curse hy.

Now tell me.

jin ko fear and greif sy nijat hy unhoon ny wada pura kia k nahi???

 

[Abdul Allah]

Re: The main contributions of ghulam ahmed parwez to islam and muslims

Just see my last post...

See my last post

Kaya wo log jo gham sy nijat yafta hain kaya unhoon ny wada pura kia?