Chairman PTI Imran Khan Speech in Peshawar - Azadi March 2.0

[BeingPakistani]

 

[Tigerkiller]

انڈین پروپیگنڈہ مشین بہت تیزی سے کام کررہی ہے امریکہ میں یوتھیوں کے مظاہروں میں فوج کے خلاف نعرے لگانے انڈین بھی پنہچ رہے ہیں

sharm kero Bajwa Kanjar aur DGISI anjum say murad sari fouj nahi.. Baqi Bajway ki kuttay wali sari dunya may ho rehi ha

 

[Tigerkiller]

No resignation —— They those who were involved should be taken their badges and their designations with dishonorable discharge from their services —- and also charged with their crimes​

ager aisa ho jaiy Army mai koi harami nutfa Paida naa hoo. Bajway jaisy loug badnam ker dia army ko

 

[Sohail Shuja]

Oh God ---Another twist ?
Chand Chand - lunar chandaa

Acha, ab chandaa Lunatic bhi ho gayee?

Nani Amma kehti hain, Chaand pey Burhya rehti hay

 

[Sohail Shuja]

And no ISI is not reporting to civilians at all. It is in fact a state within state. I think it sometimes operates on its own.

Well you can have a difference of opinion with regards to Gen Faiz and Gen Nadeem.

However, as I highlighted earlier that ISI has a basic problem in its on papers and actual formation on grounds. Of course, when the lines of reporting and command are marred, then the institution can play behind the smoke screens. In this sense, I agree that many a times, this institution has operated on its own.

 

[Maharaj Siyasi]

Acha, ab chandaa Lunatic bhi ho gayee?

Nani Amma kehti hain, Chaand pey Burhya rehti hay

Un sey humari ziyada waqfiyat nhen

 

[Maharaj Siyasi]

Well you can have a difference of opinion with regards to Gen Faiz and Gen Nadeem.

However, as I highlighted earlier that ISI has a basic problem in its on papers and actual formation on grounds. Of course, when the lines of reporting and command are marred, then the institution can play behind the smoke screens. In this sense, I agree that many a times, this institution has operated on its own.

I have another fear. The way things are being corrected towards the NRO. You never know Justice Sidiqi's rant is honored and Establishment says that "Oo jee some of our ISI officers were acting on their own in favor of Imran Khan. And were having direct instructions from IK."
You can expect every mean thing form them.

 

[Maharaj Siyasi]

There is nothing wrong in what he is saying. The only thing he forgot to say is that the Americans were on board too. The establishment, Zardaries, Sharifs and the Americans were all involved in it and the judiciary did exactly what it was told to do. IK was right to ask that if their was someone left behind who didn't conspire against him. The only thing the conspirers did not expect was a sea of people coming out in support of IK in all major world cities and itself in Pakistan too. IK played only on an American conspiracy and avoided naming the real culprits because he couldn't risk being disqualified and put out of the game for the next ten years as he is 70 years old has does not have time at hand if he wants to do something for this nation.

The Ocean of people is the only hope IK is left with. The whole world has turned against him. What will happen after he comes into power again. How he will manage the economy. Cant isolate the country from rest of the world.
"What next" is even bigger question that no one thinks about yet.

 

[miafridi]

All the best Imran khan.

امپورٹڈ_حکومت_نامنظور

 

[Shahid Abassi]

The Ocean of people is the only hope IK is left with. The whole world has turned against him. What will happen after he comes into power again. How he will manage the economy. Cant isolate the country from rest of the world.
"What next" is even bigger question that no one thinks about yet.

You have raised 3 important questions in the same post.

(1) Yes for the time being it is the masses that Ik can count on and exert pressure. The establishment, courts, smaller parties and US, all are against his return to power for now and the probabiltiy is that MLN will make a government even after the elections. But in Pakistani political senarios change every second or third year. Once Bajwa is gone and a new chief takes over, it will be a whole new ball game for political parties. IK has done a good job when things were hot and kept avoiding any criticism against the army.
.
(2) USA has big stakes in the region and would never go against Pakistan regardless of who sits in the PM seat. They didn't do anything in financial terms against Pakistan even when PTI was in government. They trust/ deal with Pakistan army and will most probably go on with the intelligence cooperation as always. They are not in a position to lose militarily powerful Pakistan specially when they are pushed out of Afghanistan, Iran, 5 central Asian states, Iraq, Syria and Turkey (to some extent). They need allies in the region even if it is not against China.
IK had good relations with UAE and Saudis who both have similar problems with president Biden. Turkey is not an issue and Europe has not given any signals against us. IK would keep relations with China and Russia as he is in Putin's good books. There were no problems with Indoneshia, Malaysia or other far eastern countries. Biden's hatered against IK, MBS, Nayhans and Maktooms is purely personal. Anybody who was in Trumps good books has been pushed away by Biden. He refused to talk to MBS, refused to sell F-35s to UAE and included them in FATF list too.
So in my opinion when Biden goes home in 2024, things will change for the better for Khan too. We as a nation should be willing to bear the heat for a couple of years if in return we can get the Americans accept us as a sovereign nations rather than continuing as a client state as always.
.
(3) Pakistan will have to stay using IMF for financing the gaps. IK has performed exceptionally well as for as domestic and international earnings go. Tax collection growth is 2200 bn rupees in 4 years where as MLN added 1500 bn in 5 years. He added 18 billion USD in our annual exports and remittances earnings in 4 years. In contrast, MLN added only 3.5 billion in five years. He brough our current account deficit down from MLN's -20 bn USD to zero and at the same time achieved a growth of 5.6%. It normally doesn't happen. When you attain growth, your CAD always goes up as you import a lot of raw materials and machinary but he achieved both of them at the same time. He could have gone on to do even better if international inflation, specially the oil prices did not jump more than twice the price in 2021.
.
Now, everyone is predicting a recession. Deutshe Bank has warned the world of a recession so early as today. We know that if the world is caught in recession, prices will nose dive and the same will happen to the interest rate. If it happens, we may use it to our advantage and succeed to cut our import to the level of 2020-2021, get away with our current account deficit and then if our export keep growing, we can come out of need for heavy borrowings.
.
So my answer is, we can get out of the financial hole and earn some respect as a sovereign state too if the economic and financial decision making is kept apolitical. The alternative is staying as a client state for ever, staying on a life saving machine with IMF for decades until we declare ourselves bankrupt.
.
Sorry for my poor english (living in a scandinavian country for 35 years with nearly no english usage ?)

 

[Maharaj Siyasi]

یار ذرا ہتھ ہولا رکھنا - اکثر زیادہ تیز دوڑتی کتی ٹرک تھلے بھی آ جاتی ہے
محاورہ ہے

Shut the hell up you paid Putwari - go earn your money somewhere else

 

[Maharaj Siyasi]

?????? ایتھے رخ

Who the hell you are ?? what is this mockery

 

[Maharaj Siyasi]

You have raised 3 important questions in the same post.

(1) Yes for the time being it is the masses that Ik can count on and exert pressure. The establishment, courts, smaller parties and US, all are against his return to power for now and the probabiltiy is that MLN will make a government even after the elections. But in Pakistani political senarios change every second or third year. Once Bajwa is gone and a new chief takes over, it will be a whole new ball game for political parties. IK has done a good job when things were hot and kept avoiding any criticism against the army.
.
(2) USA has big stakes in the region and would never go against Pakistan regardless of who sits in the PM seat. They didn't do anything in financial terms against Pakistan even when PTI was in government. They trust/ deal with Pakistan army and will most probably go on with the intelligence cooperation as always. They are not in a position to lose militarily powerful Pakistan specially when they are pushed out of Afghanistan, Iran, 5 central Asian states, Iraq, Syria and Turkey (to some extent). They need allies in the region even if it is not against China.
IK had good relations with UAE and Saudis who both have similar problems with president Biden. Turkey is not an issue and Europe has not given any signals against us. IK would keep relations with China and Russia as he is in Putin's good books. There were no problems with Indoneshia, Malaysia or other far eastern countries. Biden's hatered against IK, MBS, Nayhans and Maktooms is purely personal. Anybody who was in Trumps good books has been pushed away by Biden. He refused to talk to MBS, refused to sell F-35s to UAE and included them in FATF list too.
So in my opinion when Biden goes home in 2024, things will change for the better for Khan too. We as a nation should be willing to bear the heat for a couple of years if in return we can get the Americans accept us as a sovereign nations rather than continuing as a client state as always.
.
(3) Pakistan will have to stay using IMF for financing the gaps. IK has performed exceptionally well as for as domestic and international earnings go. Tax collection growth is 2200 bn rupees in 4 years where as MLN added 1500 bn in 5 years. He added 18 billion USD in our annual exports and remittances earnings in 4 years. In contrast, MLN added only 3.5 billion in five years. He brough our current account deficit down from MLN's -20 bn USD to zero and at the same time achieved a growth of 5.6%. It normally doesn't happen. When you attain growth, your CAD always goes up as you import a lot of raw materials and machinary but he achieved both of them at the same time. He could have gone on to do even better if international inflation, specially the oil prices did not jump more than twice the price in 2021.
.
Now, everyone is predicting a recession. Deutshe Bank has warned the world of a recession so early as today. We know that if the world is caught in recession, prices will nose dive and the same will happen to the interest rate. If it happens, we may use it to our advantage and succeed to cut our import to the level of 2020-2021, get away with our current account deficit and then if our export keep growing, we can come out of need for heavy borrowings.
.
So my answer is, we can get out of the financial hole and earn some respect as a sovereign state too if the economic and financial decision making is kept apolitical. The alternative is staying as a client state for ever, staying on a life saving machine with IMF for decades until we declare ourselves bankrupt.
.
Sorry for my poor english (living in a scandinavian country for 35 years with nearly no english usage ?)

I understand every word you said Sir. I have some agreement and a few disagreements but they are not big. It is good that you have some realistic image of the things, not like millions of Patriot IK lovers who, at this time, don't want to see the difficulties ahead. They are very very angry and they are 100% right in their anger.

I totally agree with you that US has not done anything against us financially. They could have killed IK's Govt two years ago if they wanted. Sometimes I think IK's Stance against US is a little Uncalled for. He caused himself harm just for nothing. Well IK is IK the stout and Pure person. And that is why we love him.

I also think that in current circumstances Establishment will do everything to keep IK away from power. But I am fearful that in this ordeal our country may go bankrupt. Let us accept some of the mistakes we (the PTI) have done with our economy. We are in trouble at this time.
If thieves come into power in next election too, what do you think will they be able to do anything good with the economy so that the people get some kind of relief. Will IK get Pakistan in a better place or he will have to start from zero again.

 

[Shahid Abassi]

I understand every word you said Sir. I have some agreement and a few disagreements but they are not big. It is good that you have some realistic image of the things, not like millions of Patriot IK lovers who, at this time, don't want to see the difficulties ahead. They are very very angry and they are 100% right in their anger.

I totally agree with you that US has not done anything against us financially. They could have killed IK's Govt two years ago if they wanted. Sometimes I think IK's Stance against US is a little Uncalled for. He caused himself harm just for nothing. Well IK is IK the stout and Pure person. And that is why we love him.

I also think that in current circumstances Establishment will do everything to keep IK away from power. But I am fearful that in this ordeal our country may go bankrupt. Let us accept some of the mistakes we (the PTI) have done with our economy. We are in trouble at this time.
If thieves come into power in next election too, what do you think will they be able to do anything good with the economy so that the people get some kind of relief. Will IK get Pakistan in a better place or he will have to start from zero again.

Maharaj sb. In Pakistan US has never done anything unless they are in agreement with the establishment. It is our establishment that has always been their partners. USA couldn't or wouldn't remove IK in the first two years because the establishment was not on board. Now finally they did contribute when the army was ready to do it. The Americans always play mediators and they did mediate among the establishment, PPP and the Sharifs. I have no doubt about it. American never want a corruption free, big mouth and straight forward leader in Muslim countries. They do not want a potential leader of the Muslim world. They are still dealing with a few of them and have paid a heavy price in the process. Weak, corrupt subordinat type people are their men.
Now coming back to, IK going after the Americans was a very good choice. He had two choices, either blame the army just as Nawaz did and then pay the price, or go after the USA to motivate his followers. Both of them were culprits in his over throw and he cleaverly chose the right one. Americans are very professional people and they know why and what his intentions are. His relations with the Americans will never get effected due to him cursing American interference. All the muslim leaders do it when they need public support and it is understood by the Americans.

Some people think that economy of an individual is what a country's economy is. If people are well of then everything is ok. They think, that if IK could keep the prices of commodities down, people happy and more jobs then we could say the economy is flourishing. It is totally wrong. Sharifs did it between 2013 -2018 and ruined our economy to near bankruptcy and effects of that would stay on for years. When you do it artificially and just to please your voter for the time being, you hurt your country for a very long time. They subsidized import through keeping the dollar at 100 by throwing 5-6 bn dollars in the market every year. They did it in the last two years, emptyed reserves and created a deficit in current account of 20 bn. And when IK came in power he needed to fund this 20bn + 11 bn installment on loans. That means 31 billion borrowing within two moth of his taking over. There was not a penny in the reserves to keep the dollar down artificially as they had done.

Had SA, UAE and China not bailed us out, we were bankrupt before even IK could start his own policies. It took him two years to fix the problem and bring down the current account deficit (CAD), the fastest I have ever seen. When doing this, in Egypt it too 6 years and in Greece 8 years to stablize the prices (inflation). It is never possible to cut your imports without facing a high inflation and high interest rates (when you cut imports, supply of goods in the market go down and prices shoot up just for exp if there are too little tomato crop, price of tomato will go up). He faced peoples anger but did cut imports to get away with the deficit of 20 bn. And then at last when after two years the effects of import cuts started to settle, COVID came and world inflation started pulling things down again because price of everything went up by 100-700%. He had built our reserves to 27 bn USD for the first time in our history but the world inflation ate most of it up.
.
When you say, they committed mistakes, I would have loved to hear from you that what do you consider as mistake. I can think of a few like being late in enganging IMF in 2018 and then not speculating in future prices when the oil prices were low. But these mistakes do not define our economy. They are too little things to even talk about if we are not out to do some propaganda. I know a lay man would talk about commodity prices as economy but let me tell you that there are 3 factors which contributed to inflation in Pakistan and not a single one of them was in hands of this government to avoid. 1) we had to cut our imports 2) We could not keep the dollar low as we did not have reserves to throw a penny in the market 3) International price hike due to COVID and now war. I am an economist, teaching for years and can tell you that my liking for IK are purely due to good economic policies. Please do tell me what you consider mistakes.

I would also want to tell that at least half of our inflation is due to corrupt decisions by the Nawaz government when they installed Chinese power plants, got commission and agreed to something which will kill us for 20 years. Consider nandipur producing power at 46 ruppe a unit, Quid-e-Azam solar park producing at 27 rupee a unit while similar plants are now been commissioned for 4.25 rupee. Take solar power in Layia at 4.50 rupee. Then they agreed capacity charges of 875 billion rupees a year even if we do not get a single unit from them. When MLN was agreeing tariffs of 13-16 rupees, India was installing plants that produced at 5 rupees.

And then corruption ruined it even more. They built Multan-Sukker motorway through Chines at 7.49 million dollar per Km. And the same motorway with same 6 lane was on bidding this year and an Italian company has offered to build it for 4.65 million per km.
Can go on and on... these thugs, Sharifs and Zardaris have ruined Pakistan that people don't acctually know. There few cases are of as big amounts that with that money you could build 4 motoways from Isbd to Karachi but the establishment would never let the courts to convict a politician as they use it for blackmailing them when needed.

 

[Maharaj Siyasi]

Maharaj sb. In Pakistan US has never done anything unless they are in agreement with the establishment. It is our establishment that has always been their partners. USA couldn't or wouldn't remove IK in the first two years because the establishment was not on board. Now finally they did contribute when the army was ready to do it. The Americans always play mediators and they did mediate among the establishment, PPP and the Sharifs. I have no doubt about it. American never want a corruption free, big mouth and straight forward leader in Muslim countries. They do not want a potential leader of the Muslim world. They are still dealing with a few of them and have paid a heavy price in the process. Weak, corrupt subordinat type people are their men.
Now coming back to, IK going after the Americans was a very good choice. He had two choices, either blame the army just as Nawaz did and then pay the price, or go after the USA to motivate his followers. Both of them were culprits in his over throw and he cleaverly chose the right one. Americans are very professional people and they know why and what his intentions are. His relations with the Americans will never get effected due to him cursing American interference. All the muslim leaders do it when they need public support and it is understood by the Americans.

Some people think that economy of an individual is what a country's economy is. If people are well of then everything is ok. They think, that if IK could keep the prices of commodities down, people happy and more jobs then we could say the economy is flourishing. It is totally wrong. Sharifs did it between 2013 -2018 and ruined our economy to near bankruptcy and effects of that would stay on for years. When you do it artificially and just to please your voter for the time being, you hurt your country for a very long time. They subsidized import through keeping the dollar at 100 by throwing 5-6 bn dollars in the market every year. They did it in the last two years, emptyed reserves and created a deficit in current account of 20 bn. And when IK came in power he needed to fund this 20bn + 11 bn installment on loans. That means 31 billion borrowing within two moth of his taking over. There was not a penny in the reserves to keep the dollar down artificially as they had done.

Had SA, UAE and China not bailed us out, we were bankrupt before even IK could start his own policies. It took him two years to fix the problem and bring down the current account deficit (CAD), the fastest I have ever seen. When doing this, in Egypt it too 6 years and in Greece 8 years to stablize the prices (inflation). It is never possible to cut your imports without facing a high inflation and high interest rates (when you cut imports, supply of goods in the market go down and prices shoot up just for exp if there are too little tomato crop, price of tomato will go up). He faced peoples anger but did cut imports to get away with the deficit of 20 bn. And then at last when after two years the effects of import cuts started to settle, COVID came and world inflation started pulling things down again because price of everything went up by 100-700%. He had built our reserves to 27 bn USD for the first time in our history but the world inflation ate most of it up.
.
When you say, they committed mistakes, I would have loved to hear from you that what do you consider as mistake. I can think of a few like being late in enganging IMF in 2018 and then not speculating in future prices when the oil prices were low. But these mistakes do not define our economy. They are too little things to even talk about if we are not out to do some propaganda. I know a lay man would talk about commodity prices as economy but let me tell you that there are 3 factors which contributed to inflation in Pakistan and not a single one of them was in hands of this government to avoid. 1) we had to cut our imports 2) We could not keep the dollar low as we did not have reserves to throw a penny in the market 3) International price hike due to COVID and now war. I am an economist, teaching for years and can tell you that my liking for IK are purely due to good economic policies. Please do tell me what you consider mistakes.

I would also want to tell that at least half of our inflation is due to corrupt decisions by the Nawaz government when they installed Chinese power plants, got commission and agreed to something which will kill us for 20 years. Consider nandipur producing power at 46 ruppe a unit, Quid-e-Azam solar park producing at 27 rupee a unit while similar plants are now been commissioned for 4.25 rupee. Take solar power in Layia at 4.50 rupee. Then they agreed capacity charges of 875 billion rupees a year even if we do not get a single unit from them. When MLN was agreeing tariffs of 13-16 rupees, India was installing plants that produced at 5 rupees.

And then corruption ruined it even more. They built Multan-Sukker motorway through Chines at 7.49 million dollar per Km. And the same motorway with same 6 lane was on bidding this year and an Italian company has offered to build it for 4.65 million per km.
Can go on and on... these thugs, Sharifs and Zardaris have ruined Pakistan that people don't acctually know. There few cases are of as big amounts that with that money you could build 4 motoways from Isbd to Karachi but the establishment would never let the courts to convict a politician as they use it for blackmailing them when needed.

Again Sir, I agree with lots of your analysis and do not agree with some parts. Just addressing the parts I do not agree.

I cannot comprehend how IK has played it so right, and Americans will be so liberal that they will forget and vouch for something which is a bit of over-exaggeration. It is causing lots of problems for them on the diplomatic front. Remember Putin being extra vocal over this and ridiculing it ?

For the Economy and successes of IK, You are an expert and can twist it in any direction with lots of details. But Sir economy is not a supernatural or 6th sense item that you can only feel by closing your eyes and rising your finger in the air. It is a very much tangible and visible thing. It does reflect in the common man's life. I am not able to understand the separation of Common man and Countries condition. Crippled with Debt, crippling CAD and circular deficits, World-leading Inflation, and inability to run the social programs. I don't understand where you see the success to be honest.

Sorry I am just being realistic. Let us please accept the IKs failures and rely only on his personality and clean Niyat and hope it to work in our favor. I still feel that his future course of actions will do harm to him and to the country and I am worried about what exactly will he do after coming back to power. Even though I think we may win the next election but with all of the collective might against him he may not secure 2/3rd majority to change it to a presidential system.

 

[Shahid Abassi]

Again Sir, I agree with lots of your analysis and do not agree with some parts. Just addressing the parts I do not agree.

I cannot comprehend how IK has played it so right, and Americans will be so liberal that they will forget and vouch for something which is a bit of over-exaggeration. It is causing lots of problems for them on the diplomatic front. Remember Putin being extra vocal over this and ridiculing it ?

For the Economy and successes of IK, You are an expert and can twist it in any direction with lots of details. But Sir economy is not a supernatural or 6th sense item that you can only feel by closing your eyes and rising your finger in the air. It is a very much tangible and visible thing. It does reflect in the common man's life. I am not able to understand the separation of Common man and Countries condition. Crippled with Debt, crippling CAD and circular deficits, World-leading Inflation, and inability to run the social programs. I don't understand where you see the success to be honest.

Sorry I am just being realistic. Let us please accept the IKs failures and rely only on his personality and clean Niyat and hope it to work in our favor. I still feel that his future course of actions will do harm to him and to the country and I am worried about what exactly will he do after coming back to power. Even though I think we may win the next election but with all of the collective might against him he may not secure 2/3rd majority to change it to a presidential system.

Maharaj ji, The Americans are generally frustrated with Pakistan due to our close relations with China and their future assesments that the CPEC will eventually result in giving navy bases to China. Other than that, your and my words are just subjective assessments and can be argued with examples and arguments on both sides. I do not believe that what IK claims is an exaggeration at all. The only difference is that there was nothing new in it and has been happening for decades. They have always played a part in our regime changes and Nawaz & Zardari have always lobbied in Washington to gain power in Pakistan and that not a single martial law was ever imposed here without the US backing. Pakistan has been a client state for about 50 years and we have learned to survive being so. No other country in the world plays such a prominent client-state role for a super power as we did for last few decades. Does it mean, that we should not have a healthy good relations with the USA just as Malaysia or Bangladesh have? Not at all.

Economics is a tricky subject. It needs a deeper analysis and discussion to fully understand the ups and downs of it. I did not try to twist the facts at all as I am not a cult follower of IK. I wouldn't try to justify his mistakes like appointment of Buzdar, Naivity of promises he made in the election campaign and being unprepared before taking over the primeministership but I would mostly endorse his economic policies because I find no major fault in them. I won't support IK just because he is honest, has a charismatic personality, is brave and outspoken. These are good traits to have but not enough to run a country.

A lot of times, we show our dissatisfaction for certain outcomes because we do not forsee that what was about to happen otherwise and where we really stood before that. Secondly, we tend to avoid appraising an effort without considering the given situation and the variables attached to it. It is like a cancer patient cursing the doctor for more pain after initial chemotherapy as compared to when his cancer was still hidden and unknown and gave him no pains and he enjoyed a happy life. A discussion must be logical and aided by reasoning to draw any conclusions. If you give me an economy to manage where everything is locked in to a debt financing need of 200 bn USD but even then if I come out of it with a debt of 30 bn and have initiated programs to cut it further, I would consider my job well done even if someone criticizes the debt increase of 30.

Yes you are right that people are worse of today than they were 4 years ago. The inflation has eaten up their purchasing power but (1) none of it was a doing of IK government and (2) and none of the 3 reasons for this inflation were avoidable. As I wrote earlier, it was not possible to keep the exchange rate artificially low any more by throwing more than 6 bn USD in the market every year, cut in imports was imminent as a 20 bn USD CAD was unbearable for the state and lastly, he had no control over international inflation and covid. After all he was a policy maker and not a magician who could do things out of the blue. Could you please give me an example of , what he could have done that could have helped ease the inflation but he failed to do?

You wrote about debt, CAD, circular debt and social programs. I do have qualified answers to each of these and have a deep going reasoning to justify them but I'll leave it here as I alredy have used a lot of space. If needed we could take each of them one by one at a later stage.

 

[Maharaj Siyasi]

Maharaj ji, The Americans are generally frustrated with Pakistan due to our close relations with China and their future assesments that the CPEC will eventually result in giving navy bases to China. Other than that, your and my words are just subjective assessments and can be argued with examples and arguments on both sides. I do not believe that what IK claims is an exaggeration at all. The only difference is that there was nothing new in it and has been happening for decades. They have always played a part in our regime changes and Nawaz & Zardari have always lobbied in Washington to gain power in Pakistan and that not a single martial law was ever imposed here without the US backing. Pakistan has been a client state for about 50 years and we have learned to survive being so. No other country in the world plays such a prominent client-state role for a super power as we did for last few decades. Does it mean, that we should not have a healthy good relations with the USA just as Malaysia or Bangladesh have? Not at all.

Economics is a tricky subject. It needs a deeper analysis and discussion to fully understand the ups and downs of it. I did not try to twist the facts at all as I am not a cult follower of IK. I wouldn't try to justify his mistakes like appointment of Buzdar, Naivity of promises he made in the election campaign and being unprepared before taking over the primeministership but I would mostly endorse his economic policies because I find no major fault in them. I won't support IK just because he is honest, has a charismatic personality, is brave and outspoken. These are good traits to have but not enough to run a country.

A lot of times, we show our dissatisfaction for certain outcomes because we do not forsee that what was about to happen otherwise and where we really stood before that. Secondly, we tend to avoid appraising an effort without considering the given situation and the variables attached to it. It is like a cancer patient cursing the doctor for more pain after initial chemotherapy as compared to when his cancer was still hidden and unknown and gave him no pains and he enjoyed a happy life. A discussion must be logical and aided by reasoning to draw any conclusions. If you give me an economy to manage where everything is locked in to a debt financing need of 200 bn USD but even then if I come out of it with a debt of 30 bn and have initiated programs to cut it further, I would consider my job well done even if someone criticizes the debt increase of 30.

Yes you are right that people are worse of today than they were 4 years ago. The inflation has eaten up their purchasing power but (1) none of it was a doing of IK government and (2) and none of the 3 reasons for this inflation were avoidable. As I wrote earlier, it was not possible to keep the exchange rate artificially low any more by throwing more than 6 bn USD in the market every year, cut in imports was imminent as a 20 bn USD CAD was unbearable for the state and lastly, he had no control over international inflation and covid. After all he was a policy maker and not a magician who could do things out of the blue. Could you please give me an example of , what he could have done that could have helped ease the inflation but he failed to do?

You wrote about debt, CAD, circular debt and social programs. I do have qualified answers to each of these and have a deep going reasoning to justify them but I'll leave it here as I alredy have used a lot of space. If needed we could take each of them one by one at a later stage.

I totally agree with you on lots of stuff. Yes Keeping the dollar at an artificial rate was the biggest crime Ishaqa dar has done to our economy. And As you said the economy is a tricky subject. Obviously, you and I can discuss and find reasons for Iks dismayed performance because it does not hurt us. But there is a huge poor nation that is suffering. The way things were going, I was under impression that IK will leave it and run away on his own. And I am dead sure, he found No confidence as a big blessing for him to save his future.
Now it is time for these thieves who will leave and run away as things are tumbling down fast and they will not be able to keep establishment support for that long. IK lost this support because of his failure. Thieves will lose it too.
Then there will be IKs rule again but that will be even worst period for him than what he had before. He has no team. Assad Umar was the lousiest and dumbest person he had and everyone else is not loyal to him.
Telling you the truth. The future of IK is also not that bright.

 

[Shahid Abassi]

I totally agree with you on lots of stuff. Yes Keeping the dollar at an artificial rate was the biggest crime Ishaqa dar has done to our economy. And As you said the economy is a tricky subject. Obviously, you and I can discuss and find reasons for Iks dismayed performance because it does not hurt us. But there is a huge poor nation that is suffering. The way things were going, I was under impression that IK will leave it and run away on his own. And I am dead sure, he found No confidence as a big blessing for him to save his future.
Now it is time for these thieves who will leave and run away as things are tumbling down fast and they will not be able to keep establishment support for that long. IK lost this support because of his failure. Thieves will lose it too.
Then there will be IKs rule again but that will be even worst period for him than what he had before. He has no team. Assad Umar was the lousiest and dumbest person he had and everyone else is not loyal to him.
Telling you the truth. The future of IK is also not that bright.

I do not agree with you Maharaj bhai. Yes, in common man's eyes IK's performance was not good because for the masses the only yardstick is inflation. Inflation does not always come out government's economic policies as is the case in UK, US and all over the world. Inflation in UK is 8.4% highest in 40 years. Does this mean that Boris Johnsen's economic policies are bad? No, people of UK do not think so.
IK government has done a very good job if you look at all the economic indicators.

• He increased exports much more than any government of the past. To be precise, 8 bn to MLN's -1.5.
• He, in 4 years increased revenue collection much more than MLN did in 5 years.
• He attained 5.6% growth with zero CAD ( exceptional) in his third year, MLN had to wait for its 5th year to get it to above 5.
• He brought down CAD from -20 to zero.
• He created more jobs per year as compared to MLN and PPP ( accepted by Miftah and Shirin Rahman in TV shows). 5500000 jobs in 3 years and could have fulfilled his One crore job promise if he had stayed all five years.
• Our unemployment rate is the lowest in the whole region.
• His fiscal deficit in 9 months of this year is 3.8%, MLN had it 6.8% in its last year.
• His government had accumulated 27 billion dollars in reserves before Russia - Ukraine war induced inflation ate up a part of it.
• Remittances increased 11.5 bn USD in 3 years compared to 11 billion increase in last 10 years.
• Debt to GDP ratio has decreased fron 72% to 66%. The only way to decrease our dependence on loans, is to increase exports and remittances.
• He successfuly settled Rekodig and saved the nation 11 bn USD fines, secured 10 bn USD investment and raised Pakistan's share from 25% to 50% which will benefit Pakistan for about 200 bn USD over the periode of the lease.
• He renegotiated private IPP contracts signed by MLN. No private party ever renegotiate their terms and give up its earnings but the government used pressure tactics and saved 870 bn rupees in next 10 years.
• He started the biggest social project EHSAS in the history of Pakistan. Increased yearly spending on BISP's 118 bn to 457 bn in 2022. During COVID, the government paid money to 17 million families. EHSAS and the Health Card are unmatchable social programs in Pakistan.

I can go on and on enlisting his government's economic accomplishments but it won't help much because a commom man only cares about the prices of Aloo, piaz and atta. But even then our retail commodity prices are still cheaper than prices in India.

AND don't forget we had COVID.

 

[Maharaj Siyasi]

I

AND don't forget we had COVID.

Very good Good info Sir. Now let me put my view on some of the points. I am pasting your write up and my comments will be in red

• He increased exports much more than any government of the past. To be precise, 8 bn to MLN's -1.5.
• Definitely a marvelous achievement. However much of the credit goes to the over the depreciation of Rupee and the Covid closure of India and Bangladesh. with 60% loss on our currency value i will cut 60% from 8 billion. So a proper benchmark we gained about 3.2 billion (Am I right or wrong ? in this laymen benchmarking)
• He, in 4 years increased revenue collection much more than MLN did in 5 years.
• Definitely another major achievement. However, this is the direct result of documenting the transections which was already initiated by PMLN. And major Push came from NAB fears and FATF requirements.
• He attained 5.6% growth with zero CAD ( exceptional) in his third year, MLN had to wait for its 5th year to get it to above 5.
• He brought down CAD from -20 to zero.
• Both of the above two points are absolute deception of IK Govt. In fact bringing the CAD down to zero was where the destruction started. I don't know who convinced IK to show it as his achievement. He Actually halted the economy to stad still and cur the imports to artificialaly show it as achivement. Most likely the Nalaaeq tareen in saan Asad Umar. And we are suffereing today. Soon as the LMS grew up we are back at square-1 with CAD. What is achievement here ?
• He created more jobs per year as compared to MLN and PPP ( accepted by Miftah and Shirin Rahman in TV shows). 5500000 jobs in 3 years and could have fulfilled his One crore job promise if he had stayed all five years.
• Well I have 6 Engineers in different disciplines, my dear Niece and Nephews star graduates from different Universities. All are doing some low-level IT works none got any job - still chanting IK slogans (young generation stupidity ?). The reality is that there was a massive loss of jobs as well. On this figure, you just have to depend on what Govt tells you. And No Govt will ever tell you correct figure. But it very much reflects in the general condition of Public. Which is not good sir. Lots of un-employment and frustration there is.
• Our unemployment rate is the lowest in the whole region.
• Total Mockery and deception. Our Statistics do not count 60% of our population - if i am not exaggerating
• His fiscal deficit in 9 months of this year is 3.8%, MLN had it 6.8% in its last year.
• Could be right. I dont have any figures in my mind.
• His government had accumulated 27 billion dollars in reserves before Russia - Ukraine war induced inflation ate up a part of it.
• All reserved are just loans and treasury bonds sales which will keep killing us in next 10 years. When he saw his ship sinking he gave stupid subsidy to put land mines in the path of the Govt of Thieves. He is much more smarter and cunning than he used to be. I was actually disappointed on his decision of subsidy. A gust of doubt came in my mind that "is he really thinking about improving or he is just another manipulator like other thieves".
• Remittances increased 11.5 bn USD in 3 years compared to 11 billion increase in last 10 years.
• Yes Very true they increased. Mostly because of Digital Rosha accounts. which is a very good part. Let us accept that it was less in love of IK, more to support the in-home families in the crippling Inflation. I will be very closely looking at the remittances in next few months of Thieves. To understand this strange phenomenon, If remittances goes down more than 30% then it will be IKs achievement. If it doesn't than it was need of the hour only.
• Debt to GDP ratio has decreased from 72% to 66%. The only way to decrease our dependence on loans, is to increase exports and remittances.
• Sorry do not want to sound bad, but this is the wrong fiure. It is hovering close to 90% and experts say that if you count all domestic and external debts it is close to 110%. I can give you some links to prove my point.
• He successfuly settled Rekodig and saved the nation 11 bn USD fines, secured 10 bn USD investment and raised Pakistan's share from 25% to 50% which will benefit Pakistan for about 200 bn USD over the periode of the lease.
• I literally laughed at how IK and his ministers presented it. We just accepted the punishment of ICJ and gave everything that the company wanted. He has implemented that bad contract in letter and spirit.
• He renegotiated private IPP contracts signed by MLN. No private party ever renegotiate their terms and give up its earnings but the government used pressure tactics and saved 870 bn rupees in next 10 years.
• Another deception and mockery to the poor nation. IPPs were on the losing side now. they were not able to blackmail govt due to extra generation capacity that thieves have left. Let us please give those devils their credit. We could have kicked most of the old IPPS out completely. I will not go in detail at this point but IK is responsible of the increasing circular debt because of bringing IPPs back in the game and shutting the high-efficiency power plants down. THIS IS NOTHING LESS THAN A CRIME HE HAS COMMITTED TO THIS POOR NATION -- PERIOD.
• He started the biggest social project EHSAS in the history of Pakistan. Increased yearly spending on BISP's 118 bn to 457 bn in 2022. During COVID, the government paid money to 17 million families. EHSAS and the Health Card are unmatchable social programs in Pakistan.
• Yes that is absolutely correct and I praise IK for this. Even though Auditor General pointed out 40 billion Rs irregularities which could very well turn into Corruption cases.

AND don't forget we had COVID.
We did not have covid as other nations had Our BCG vaccination program worked for us. And It was a special Rehmat from Allah as well on us.
I think we reached herd immunity well before world came to know about COVID. Otherwise, the smart lockdowns and other monkey jobs were just things to tell other world. The reality was totally different. We never separated the sick from healthy people. In fact, we scarred sick people away.

 

[Shahid Abassi]

• He increased exports much more than any government of the past. To be precise, 8 bn to MLN's -1.5.
• Definitely a marvelous achievement. However much of the credit goes to the over the depreciation of Rupee and the Covid closure of India and Bangladesh. with 60% loss on our currency value i will cut 60% from 8 billion. So a proper benchmark we gained about 3.2 billion (Am I right or wrong ? in this laymen benchmarking)
• He, in 4 years increased revenue collection much more than MLN did in 5 years.
• Definitely another major achievement. However, this is the direct result of documenting the transections which was already initiated by PMLN. And major Push came from NAB fears and FATF requirements.
• He attained 5.6% growth with zero CAD ( exceptional) in his third year, MLN had to wait for its 5th year to get it to above 5.
• He brought down CAD from -20 to zero.
• Both of the above two points are absolute deception of IK Govt. In fact bringing the CAD down to zero was where the destruction started. I don't know who convinced IK to show it as his achievement. He Actually halted the economy to stad still and cur the imports to artificialaly show it as achivement. Most likely the Nalaaeq tareen in saan Asad Umar. And we are suffereing today. Soon as the LMS grew up we are back at square-1 with CAD. What is achievement here ?
• He created more jobs per year as compared to MLN and PPP ( accepted by Miftah and Shirin Rahman in TV shows). 5500000 jobs in 3 years and could have fulfilled his One crore job promise if he had stayed all five years.
• Well I have 6 Engineers in different disciplines, my dear Niece and Nephews star graduates from different Universities. All are doing some low-level IT works none got any job - still chanting IK slogans (young generation stupidity ?). The reality is that there was a massive loss of jobs as well. On this figure, you just have to depend on what Govt tells you. And No Govt will ever tell you correct figure. But it very much reflects in the general condition of Public. Which is not good sir. Lots of un-employment and frustration there is.
• Our unemployment rate is the lowest in the whole region.
• Total Mockery and deception. Our Statistics do not count 60% of our population - if i am not exaggerating
• His fiscal deficit in 9 months of this year is 3.8%, MLN had it 6.8% in its last year.
• Could be right. I dont have any figures in my mind.
• His government had accumulated 27 billion dollars in reserves before Russia - Ukraine war induced inflation ate up a part of it.
• All reserved are just loans and treasury bonds sales which will keep killing us in next 10 years. When he saw his ship sinking he gave stupid subsidy to put land mines in the path of the Govt of Thieves. He is much more smarter and cunning than he used to be. I was actually disappointed on his decision of subsidy. A gust of doubt came in my mind that "is he really thinking about improving or he is just another manipulator like other thieves".
• Remittances increased 11.5 bn USD in 3 years compared to 11 billion increase in last 10 years.
• Yes Very true they increased. Mostly because of Digital Rosha accounts. which is a very good part. Let us accept that it was less in love of IK, more to support the in-home families in the crippling Inflation. I will be very closely looking at the remittances in next few months of Thieves. To understand this strange phenomenon, If remittances goes down more than 30% then it will be IKs achievement. If it doesn't than it was need of the hour only.
• Debt to GDP ratio has decreased from 72% to 66%. The only way to decrease our dependence on loans, is to increase exports and remittances.
• Sorry do not want to sound bad, but this is the wrong fiure. It is hovering close to 90% and experts say that if you count all domestic and external debts it is close to 110%. I can give you some links to prove my point.
• He successfuly settled Rekodig and saved the nation 11 bn USD fines, secured 10 bn USD investment and raised Pakistan's share from 25% to 50% which will benefit Pakistan for about 200 bn USD over the periode of the lease.
• I literally laughed at how IK and his ministers presented it. We just accepted the punishment of ICJ and gave everything that the company wanted. He has implemented that bad contract in letter and spirit.
• He renegotiated private IPP contracts signed by MLN. No private party ever renegotiate their terms and give up its earnings but the government used pressure tactics and saved 870 bn rupees in next 10 years.
• Another deception and mockery to the poor nation. IPPs were on the losing side now. they were not able to blackmail govt due to extra generation capacity that thieves have left. Let us please give those devils their credit. We could have kicked most of the old IPPS out completely. I will not go in detail at this point but IK is responsible of the increasing circular debt because of bringing IPPs back in the game and shutting the high-efficiency power plants down. THIS IS NOTHING LESS THAN A CRIME HE HAS COMMITTED TO THIS POOR NATION -- PERIOD.
• He started the biggest social project EHSAS in the history of Pakistan. Increased yearly spending on BISP's 118 bn to 457 bn in 2022. During COVID, the government paid money to 17 million families. EHSAS and the Health Card are unmatchable social programs in Pakistan.
• Yes that is absolutely correct and I praise IK for this. Even though Auditor General pointed out 40 billion Rs irregularities which could very well turn into Corruption cases.

AND don't forget we had COVID.
We did not have covid as other nations had Our BCG vaccination program worked for us. And It was a special Rehmat from Allah as well on us.
I think we reached herd immunity well before world came to know about COVID. Otherwise, the smart lockdowns and other monkey jobs were just things to tell other world. The reality was totally different. We never separated the sick from healthy people. In fact, we scarred sick people away.

Dear Maharaj sb, Thanks for taking time and writting an alternative view point that now looks more like professor Ahsan Iqbal talking ?. In my humble opinion, most of your answers are factually incorrect, some are subjective and others are (forgive me for saying that) a layman finding excuses. Please give me a couple of days to answer these points as I am to meet a dead line for filing a few tax returns before 1st May for my clients. Its nice to have some constructive discussion on these pages rather than reading abuses and reabuses on all the thread. In the mean time, I would like to wish you and your family a very happy Eid. Stay blessed
.
For the time being a short reply so you did think that I had given up on you ??