Why PTI Will Loose Today

Theekra

Senator (1k+ posts)
First, Lets answer your questions of of PML-N good governance and then move on to PTI's achievements.

1) You said Load shedding has been reduced. Its interesting because I can put my Hands on Quran and tell you that in the normal situation it is still 12 hour load shedding(in 24 hours, with strict schedule of 1 hour light and 1 hour load shedding) and in worse scenario it reaches to 16 to 18 hours in a day, yes but it is better on rare days from 6 to 10 hours only(very rarely). Besides tell me the projects which are done and in which MW are added to the national grid please.. Yes they can generate electricity through GAS and FUEL but that costs alot and perhaps they are only making it for the industries, because load shedding as i said still is the same.

2)Terrorism: I won't give long lecture because you are wise enough yourself, and i would only give short answer. It is widely known who makes decision for Pakistan, Be it Zarb-e-azab, Good relations with Afghan and the Karachi operation. The decision isn't probably made by NS but by the Army who are tired of fighting since long due to incompetent rulers, because in peaceful times everything that an Army does is enjoyment but in long wars they get tired which they have been. This analysis is further strengthened by the decision of the parliament not to send troops to the Arab league when NS due to his good relations(or favors of the arabs over him) wanted to send them(according to analysts who says that they have now put the blame over the parliament but still due to Arabs anger they had to send first their brother Shahbaz and then went to the Arabs)

3) Inflation and economy: Inflation has been on the decline since 2008(mainly after 2010, but in 2008 it was highest) where the 3 years(2008,2009,2010) had the highest inflation due to many factors including a surge in the terrorism, political situation of Pakistan, heavy floods that had destroyed the crops(main in 2010 which had made the prices of the vegetables and other things almost unreachable to the common people because of the crops being destroyed) and last but not the least the oil prices which were at peak in 2008, but came down in 2009 and 2010 which had an effect on bringing down the inflation which was still hit by the 2010 floods and inflation couldn't be controlled much but in the subsequent years when the effects of floods were on deline the inflation was also on decline. I still believe that with the histroric low Fuel prices this year the inflation should have been even less than the declining phase(of post 2010) that it is going through for the last few years(whose slow decline was due to the effects of the floods).

See the link below and compare it...

http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/FP.CPI.TOTL.ZG

Now lets come to PTI achievements in KPK:


Well the writing is on the Wall. Even the Media when report something against PTI it is not because PTI does something worst than the other parties haven't done, its because of the standard of PTI that they report such thing. For example Media doesn't report the 40 plus convoy of leaders of other parties as it is normal, but when there is 16 plus vehicle's convoy in a PTI leaders visit, it is reported by the media and criticized and rightly so but still this keeps the PTI better than other parties on comparison level.

Apart from that you won't see Peshawar as even close to Lahore for in infrastructure, mainly because you cannot compare someone's performance based on the fact that one house is well decorated than the others, but to evaluate one's performance you have to see what was the condition of the house when someone took over it. For example their are 2 houses, One is build using billions of rupees and has many many facilities than another house which was built using millions of rupees, So the one constructed using billions should have better rooms, floors, tiled walls etc etc, while the one built with millions only have walls built but inside structure needs much much investment(or at least better use of resources if you have less investment) to make it look good let alone bringing it at par with the one having higher investment.

Same is the case with Lahore and Peshawar(i am taking these examples because people tend to compare only these two when measuring the performance). Peshawar was under someone who were famous for taking bribe under the name of Easy load. No one came to know where they spent the money aloted for security, Jobs and admissions were openly on Sale etc etc. Now everything you see about Peshawar(and most of KPK) has changed be it the laws, the infrastructure which is getting better each day with better management than having better resources, and the institutions are getting better where the sense of corruption is on decline and you may see now see government employees protesting for raise in Pay not because Government of KPK's bad performance but because they are not allowed to take bribe so they cannot afford to live in their same salary as before.

Lastly, I would say that it is better institutions that builds up nations and not better dictators. If you have a better dictator and he spends money for the good of people all the time and do good projects and make people happy but won't set the institutions to work independently and with merit there will be a time when the dictator will be replaced suddenly by a bad dictator and he will in no time reverse the good things done by a good dictator. Unlike this fact if one makes the institutions stronger enough(free of political interference) that no one is able to influence them, it will keep the country running without the ruler even noticing(or sitting on a couch and just enjoying the progress being made unlike the fact that they will have to take notice of each and every incident which Shahbaz does, because if the Police in Punjab would have been better Shahbaz may never have to take notice of incidents like someone's dog bit a person, or someone raped someone etc because all these things would have been dealt by the stronger institution itself without needing shahbaz's involvement in it)


Dude, did I even name Punjab Govt.? And look at you giving long lectures about Shahbaz.

Moreover, you long lecture of PTI govt. was good except you forgot to name these 'institutions' that have been developed in KPK.

Without naming these "insitutions" and citing their *actual* improved performance measures, this whole lecture is a big pile of nothing. 0 + 0 = 0.

I love the way PTI convinces its gullible fans that it is building some invisible 'institutions', somewhere in the woods where no one can see them, and voila, one day they'll come out of the woods and turn the province upside down!

Well, in real world, Riaz Thekedar is providing relief to refugee camps outside Nowshehra, displaced by the rainstrom. There go your 'institutions'!
 

ahameed

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
what do u call an independent police/nab/school/health monitoring system/right to services commission,right to information commission, INSTITUTIONS, nahi???????????

Dude, did I even name Punjab Govt.? And look at you giving long lectures about Shahbaz.

Moreover, you long lecture of PTI govt. was good except you forgot to name these 'institutions' that have been developed in KPK.

Without naming these "insitutions" and citing their *actual* improved performance measures, this whole lecture is a big pile of nothing. 0 + 0 = 0.

I love the way PTI convinces its gullible fans that it is building some invisible 'institutions', somewhere in the woods where no one can see them, and voila, one day they'll come out of the woods and turn the province upside down!

Well, in real world, Riaz Thekedar is providing relief to refugee camps outside Nowshehra, displaced by the rainstrom. There go your 'institutions'!
 

Theekra

Senator (1k+ posts)
what do u call an independent police/nab/school/health monitoring system/right to services commission,right to information commission, INSTITUTIONS, nahi???????????


Shashkay and show-shaw. Paper-ads to impress people overseas.

(anything to show?? Better school enrollment? Better infant mortality? More investment? Anything??)
 

miafridi

Prime Minister (20k+ posts)
Dude, did I even name Punjab Govt.? And look at you giving long lectures about Shahbaz.

Moreover, you long lecture of PTI govt. was good except you forgot to name these 'institutions' that have been developed in KPK.

Without naming these "insitutions" and citing their *actual* improved performance measures, this whole lecture is a big pile of nothing. 0 + 0 = 0.

I love the way PTI convinces its gullible fans that it is building some invisible 'institutions', somewhere in the woods where no one can see them, and voila, one day they'll come out of the woods and turn the province upside down!

Well, in real world, Riaz Thekedar is providing relief to refugee camps outside Nowshehra, displaced by the rainstrom. There go your 'institutions'!

I compared with punjab government because that's the only competitor left. PPP, MQM, JUI-f are no match and have limited support base..

AS for the institutions they cover Police, Hospitals, Civil Services etc. Need me to list the reforms done? We being resident here have witnessed these things. I am not government official but have tons of Government officials(my friends, cousins, uncles) etc who are the main source of my information regarding the good governance of PTI. Despite they being hand tight now, they say that are happy. Its like the effect that you don't like bribe but since everyone is taking it as normal routine so you adapt in the situation and also accept it, but when the government take strict measures against it and punish those who takes it(in return also give you few benefits and salary raise etc) then you happily accept it, because in normal circumstances if the bribe is common, then not taking it may make you even Jobless..
 

Theekra

Senator (1k+ posts)


Now we are talking!

Still, a slight mistake: You have to make a comparison with 2012-13, the right way to look at those numbers.

Here is a summary of educational performances of all provinces based on 4 parameters: enrollment, quality, gender equality and drop-out rate:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/238404423...Education-Ranking-2013-Summary-Report-in-Urdu

http://www.scribd.com/doc/238403125...Education-Ranking-2014-Summary-Report-in-Urdu

KPK moved from 63 to 62(basically because the drop-out rate also increased along with enrollment)

Better enrollment is a positive 'step', not some "reform". Make all those things better by 5% and Punjab might vote for you.
 

Theekra

Senator (1k+ posts)


In general, there has been some change(not "reform", as reform is permanent. This is just due to IG KPK), but the effects are yet to come.

2014 stats were still pretty bad(2015 isn't over yet so data is insufficient)

http://www.dawn.com/news/1146772/kp-govt-admits-higher-crime-terrorism-incidence
http://www.dawn.com/news/1146772/kp-govt-admits-higher-crime-terrorism-incidence

 

ahameed

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
The reports you are referring to only cover 2-3 months of PTI Govt as the report was released in 2014 only covers the period upto Sep 2013.

1. 2012---->Punjab is better than KPK(According to Alif Ailan Report).
2. 2013---->Punjab is better than KPK(According to Alif Ailan Report).
3. 2014---->KPK is better than Punjab(According to Fed Govt report,its obvious that KPK performed better in 2014 than in 2012&2013).

Increase in enrolment is result of some reforms like Transparent/Competent Teachers Induction through NTS, Independent Monitoring Unit System etc coupled with effective enrolment campaign. You will see more reforms when Local Govt System gets in place as more powers will be given to the local ppl to monitor their schools.

Now we are talking!

Still, a slight mistake: You have to make a comparison with 2012-13, the right way to look at those numbers.

Here is a summary of educational performances of all provinces based on 4 parameters: enrollment, quality, gender equality and drop-out rate:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/238404423...Education-Ranking-2013-Summary-Report-in-Urdu

http://www.scribd.com/doc/238403125...Education-Ranking-2014-Summary-Report-in-Urdu

KPK moved from 63 to 62(basically because the drop-out rate also increased along with enrollment)

Better enrollment is a positive 'step', not some "reform". Make all those things better by 5% and Punjab might vote for you.
 

ahameed

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
Still, a slight mistake: You have to make a comparison with 2012-13, the right way to look at those numbers.

here, you go, we are looking at the numbers over the same period last year and this year!

Dispute Resolution Committees(No Wakeel/No Kachery, FREE&Speedy Justice), SMS Complaint system, FIR is included in right to services act, local ppl will be able to monitor police's performance once local govts etc all are reforms which are going to stay even present IG is gone, but obviously only reforms will not do anything, unless u have a competent man/team to get those reforms implemented.


In general, there has been some change(not "reform", as reform is permanent. This is just due to IG KPK), but the effects are yet to come.

2014 stats were still pretty bad(2015 isn't over yet so data is insufficient)

http://www.dawn.com/news/1146772/kp-govt-admits-higher-crime-terrorism-incidence
http://www.dawn.com/news/1146772/kp-govt-admits-higher-crime-terrorism-incidence

 

Theekra

Senator (1k+ posts)
The reports you are referring to only cover 2-3 months of PTI Govt as the report was released in 2014 only covers the period upto Sep 2013.

1. 2012---->Punjab is better than KPK(According to Alif Ailan Report).
2. 2013---->Punjab is better than KPK(According to Alif Ailan Report).
3. 2014---->KPK is better than Punjab(According to Fed Govt report,its obvious that KPK performed better in 2014 than in 2012&2013).

Increase in enrolment is result of some reforms like Transparent/Competent Teachers Induction through NTS, Independent Monitoring Unit System etc coupled with effective enrolment campaign. You will see more reforms when Local Govt System gets in place as more powers will be given to the local ppl to monitor their schools.


Unforunately, thats not true.

Alif Ailan report clearly indicates surge in enrollment in 2014(63 to 92), but with an accompanied higher dropout rate, if you take a proper look.

Alif Ailan report comes out in May every year and includes data till that period from several sources. If you look at the report, it DOES show the surge of enrollment reported by the report you mentioned so PTI govt.'s period is indeed included.

 

Theekra

Senator (1k+ posts)
here, you go, we are looking at the numbers over the same period last year and this year!

Dispute Resolution Committees(No Wakeel/No Kachery, FREE&Speedy Justice), SMS Complaint system, FIR is included in right to services act, local ppl will be able to monitor police's performance once local govts etc all are reforms which are going to stay even present IG is gone, but obviously only reforms will not do anything, unless u have a competent man/team to get those reforms implemented.


Dear, those 'things' that you mentioned stay things as long as there isn't data to support that they are in MASSIVE use. 5 dispute resolution committees for the entire KPK that no one uses and has almost zero effect is precisely what I call show-shaw. Until then, they are just as effective as Shehbaz Sharif's land record registration.

I am sure you'd be tearing PMLN apart if they had claimed the same 'set of achievements' with promises of local govt bla bla.
 

gazoomartian

Prime Minister (20k+ posts)


Fellow Citizens,

I predicted before the election that PTI will loose and got a lot of gripe from most you all. I am sure Khan Sb, his other party leaders and you as PTI supporters will make various excuses for the loss.
I am a paid party member and I dont make excuses. I agree that PTI made a terrible mistake of being overly confident that the seat from NA264 was in their bag. We made a mistake of being overly confident and did not do any door to door canvassing, might even be for the fear of terrorist attempt to kill leaders.
whoever says what, chairman takes full responsibility and should learn from it for the national election in 2018.

Without discounting any of them with certainty, I believe the main reason is that PTIs performance in KPK is nominal/marginal at best. Let me explain further.
Performance in KPK is 100 times better than Sindh, BL and Punjab despite that KPK has been abandoned by the fed. Even in Canada provinces rely on financial support from the federal govt. In Pakistan, the PMLN govt is pouring $$ in Punjab (or in their foreign accounts)

In May 2013, the silent voters came out because on-paper PTI looked promising and everything they said is WHAT WE ALL WANT TO BE IMPLEMENTED. So, a wave of those came out to vote. Today many of those silent voters, either voted for JI or didnt came out at all because they, like me, dont see any major difference in KPK. PTI is and continues to be a great party to listen to in talk shows and live events; they are absent in real world implementation phase.

You live in the US, so I seriously doubt that you were in KHI just to vote or be absent.

Two years and counting and all PTI can say is police reforms in a state 140+ children were murdered in day light; while not a single person was held accountable in PTI or the department under them i.e. police. Shame on PTI, Shame on Imran Khan.

PS - I want my vote (from 2013 election) back unless the PTI leadership comes out to apologize, beyond which I want to see each PTI leader spend full day working on the upbringing on KPK. Any other activity should be conducted on their spare time (overtime).


you should do some reality check, and get some political education.

but nice attempt to put down IK & PTI.
 
____________کم نوں چک کے رکھو:lol:
I am very sorry to say but we love eye candy progress like METRO. In my opinion Today'PTI in KPK is much stronger than what it was in 2013 GE. It's because poor people in KPK are the first to get benefits from IK's vision. I have visited most of the KPK recently, PTI support in urban and rural areas is tremendous and above my expectations. IK is right when he says go for a re-election in KP and PTI will emerge as a clear winner with enough majority to form a government. PTI had been in power for just 2 years and it's too early to demand back your VOTE. Do not forget that corruption index of KPK was higher than other provinces of Pakistan before PTI's government.

PTI's greatest achievement is Local bodies system that they are going to implement in KP next month. It will be a game changer and will prove to be the last nail in the coffin of Moulana Diesel and ANP's politics of munafiqat and dollars
 

ahameed

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
DCRs figs!

10690252_882300091791755_1593121615353494321_n.jpg
Dear, those 'things' that you mentioned stay things as long as there isn't data to support that they are in MASSIVE use. 5 dispute resolution committees for the entire KPK that no one uses and has almost zero effect is precisely what I call show-shaw. Until then, they are just as effective as Shehbaz Sharif's land record registration.

I am sure you'd be tearing PMLN apart if they had claimed the same 'set of achievements' with promises of local govt bla bla.
 

ahameed

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
Bhai g i m 100% sure that the report titled "2104 report" was released in 2014 and only covers upto Sep 2013. In Pakistan enrolemnt is done in Marc/April each year, so its not possible to collect/present the data of whole Pakistan withing 30-40 days.

Unforunately, thats not true.

Alif Ailan report clearly indicates surge in enrollment in 2014(63 to 92), but with an accompanied higher dropout rate, if you take a proper look.

Alif Ailan report comes out in May every year and includes data till that period from several sources. If you look at the report, it DOES show the surge of enrollment reported by the report you mentioned so PTI govt.'s period is indeed included.
 

Theekra

Senator (1k+ posts)
Bhai g i m 100% sure that the report titled "2104 report" was released in 2014 and only covers upto Sep 2013. In Pakistan enrolemnt is done in Marc/April each year, so its not possible to collect/present the data of whole Pakistan withing 30-40 days.

Bhai sahib Alif Ailan sirf already present reports se data leti hai. ASER ka data poore saal ka hota hai. How else would you explain the surge in enrollment? Ab 92 se uper kia KPK me enrollment 100 se bhi uper ho gai hai?
 

ahameed

Chief Minister (5k+ posts)
Plz watch first few mins where zaidi sb is expalining it! the different numbers u r seeing is bcoz of different methodology used, i am sure u r aware of that :)
Bhai sahib Alif Ailan sirf already present reports se data leti hai. ASER ka data poore saal ka hota hai. How else would you explain the surge in enrollment? Ab 92 se uper kia KPK me enrollment 100 se bhi uper ho gai hai?
 

Theekra

Senator (1k+ posts)
Plz watch first few mins where zaidi sb is expalining it! the different numbers u r seeing is bcoz of different methodology used, i am sure u r aware of that :)


Well, thanks for proving to me what I was saying. Zaidi clearly said its period goes till Nov, December.

That includes 6 months of PTI govt. If you have another comprehensive neutral source of educational statistics that covers a more recent period, I'd believe that. Till then, this is what I'd believe since its consistent with the data sources you mentioned that indicate improved enrollment.

Specifically, if you have to prove *success* by rating better enrollment only, you'll HAVE to prove the students are not dropping out faster and not just temporarily entering over some incentive to leave quickly.
 

Theekra

Senator (1k+ posts)
Plz watch first few mins where zaidi sb is expalining it! the different numbers u r seeing is bcoz of different methodology used, i am sure u r aware of that :)

One more thing: Try to look at data from a statistician's point of view rather than proving a point for a party. Will help you.