آصف زرداری نے شہباز شریف کو وزیراعظم کا امیدوار نامزد کر دیا

حکومت کے خلاف اپوزیشن کی عدم اعتماد کی تحریک کے حوالے سے ن لیگ اور پیپلزپارٹی میں ڈیڈ لاک تاحال دور نہیں ہوسکا ہے۔

رپورٹ کے مطابق تحریک عدم اعتماد کے معاملے پر ن لیگ اور پیپلزپارٹی میں اتفاق رائے پیدا نہیں ہوسکا ہے جس کے بعد صورتحال ابھی بھی بے یقینی کا شکار ہے۔ پی پی پہلے اسپیکر کے خلاف تحریک عدم اعتماد لانا چاہتی ہے مگر ن لیگ وزیراعظم کے خلاف تحریک لانے پر بضد ہے۔

رپورٹ کے مطابق پیپلزپارٹی عدم اعتماد کی کامیابی کے بعد بقیہ مدت کیلئے ایک عبوری حکومت کے قیام کی تجویز دے رہی ہے جبکہ ن لیگ اس حکومت کے خاتمے کے بعد اسمبلیاں تحلیل کرواکے فوری عام انتخابات منعقد کروانے کی خواہاں ہیں۔

یہ بھی خبریں زیر گردش ہیں کہ بلاول بھٹو نے مطالبہ کیا کہ میرے لانگ مارچ کے اختتام تک تحریک عدم اعتماد پیش نہ کی جائے۔ واضح رہے کپ پیپلز پارٹی کے مطابق بلاول کا لانگ مارچ 8 مارچ کو اسلام آباد میں اختتام پذیر ہو گا۔

ملاقات کے دوران آصف زرداری نے شہباز شریف سے مکالمہ کرتے ہوئے کہا کوئی کچھ بھی کہے ہمارے وزیراعظم کے امیدوار آپ ہیں۔ اپوزیشن جماعتوں نے وزیراعظم کے خلاف تحریک عدم اعتماد لانے کا ٹاسک آصف علی زرداری کے سپرد کر دیا ہے۔

مشاورت کے دوران پیپلزپارٹی نے سب سے پہلے قومی اسمبلی کے اسپیکرکے خلاف عدم اعتماد کی تحریک جمع کروانے کی تجویز دی ہے اور موقف اپنایا ہے کہ اسپیکر کے خلاف تحریک کے نتائج سے صورتحال واضح ہوجائے گی۔

رپورٹ میں ذرائع کا حوالہ دے کر بتایا گیا ہے کہ آئندہ چند روز میں اسپیکر قومی اسمبلی کے خلاف تحریک عدم اعتماد جمع کروانے کا امکان ہے۔

واضح رہے کہ گزشتہ روز مسلم لیگ ن ، پیپلزپارٹی کی قیادت اور جمیعت علمائے اسلام کے رہنماؤں کی ایک بیٹھک ہوئی تھی جس میں مختلف امور پر تبادلہ خیال کیا گیا تاہم یہ ملاقات بے نتیجہ ثابت ہوئی۔

دوسری جانب کچھ میڈیا ہاؤسز کی جانب سے دعویٰ کیا جا رہا ہے کہ اپوزیشن کے درمیان وزیراعظم کے خلاف تحریک عدم اعتماد لانے پر اتفاق ہو چکا ہے۔

 

[Siberite]

? ? ?
Thanks for being honest..

Thanks for being dishonest..

 

[Awan S]

It is quite a long time that opposition is bickering ,going back and forth trying to dislodge the Government. It could have never been such a mission . I don't understand how weak this opposition is that they having issues arranging the non confidence motion . I have see n many times the opposition was unable to bring their own chairman in senate and too many of the drafts from government have p[assed through
the senate where the opposition is in majority .
I don't think the PMLN or any other party can do any better running the country. We are in for a long shock.

There are two things you have raised.

First in term of no confidence, they have two things as well. One that establishment look neutral although they may not be. Secondly they want to show attractions to government people that join us and we can offer you ticket as well as ministry. There is not much time left in either case. Government people know very well that they have no chance of winning elections in future to win elections on PTI ticket. If they miss train this time, they may not get PML(N) ticket later which will be too demanding later.

Your second question, what opposition will do different? PML(N) is an experienced party; they can ensure good governance. There is lot of important law making pending due to Khan's stub born behavior not to sit with opposition leader. Experienced party may do efforts to reduce inflation to some kind. Remember PML(N) got inflation over 12% and they bring that back to 4% gradually. PML(N) has much better relationship with China & Saudia to gain some help in terms of loans.

 

[Awan S]

Very good decision of opposition. AAZB is the best candidate for Prime ministership. He is very experienced and no charges of corruption.
In past this innocent person named AAZB was wrongly accused on corruption so its time to compensate.
Congratulations to whole opposition and in particular PMLN.

Who is AAZD, do you mean Zardari? SS or Shahbaz Sharif is candidate as PM. Well as I have said earlier that Khan has the right to complete his term. It does not matter, he came with the help of establishment as others used the same route. On the other side, if Khan is removed that will not be first ever thing as no PM in history completed its term. I think no one is innocent and we have to look into capability rather than being honest. We have seen Khan as honest without capability. Beauty without brain ?

 

[Okara]

Who is AAZD, do you mean Zardari? SS or Shahbaz Sharif is candidate as PM. Well as I have said earlier that Khan has the right to complete his term. It does not matter, he came with the help of establishment as others used the same route. On the other side, if Khan is removed that will not be first ever thing as no PM in history completed its term. I think no one is innocent and we have to look into capability rather than being honest. We have seen Khan as honest without capability. Beauty without brain ?

AAZB=Asif Ali Zardari Bhutto.
How do u define Capability? Can u share few things which were improved under AAZB and Nawaz Shareef? Can u give me name of one project built by ur leaders and are not running on Subsidy? Let me subsidy: If government is buy something at higher price and selling it a low the difference is called subsidy.

 

[Saboo]

حکومت کے خلاف اپوزیشن کی عدم اعتماد کی تحریک کے حوالے سے ن لیگ اور پیپلزپارٹی میں ڈیڈ لاک تاحال دور نہیں ہوسکا ہے۔

رپورٹ کے مطابق تحریک عدم اعتماد کے معاملے پر ن لیگ اور پیپلزپارٹی میں اتفاق رائے پیدا نہیں ہوسکا ہے جس کے بعد صورتحال ابھی بھی بے یقینی کا شکار ہے۔ پی پی پہلے اسپیکر کے خلاف تحریک عدم اعتماد لانا چاہتی ہے مگر ن لیگ وزیراعظم کے خلاف تحریک لانے پر بضد ہے۔

رپورٹ کے مطابق پیپلزپارٹی عدم اعتماد کی کامیابی کے بعد بقیہ مدت کیلئے ایک عبوری حکومت کے قیام کی تجویز دے رہی ہے جبکہ ن لیگ اس حکومت کے خاتمے کے بعد اسمبلیاں تحلیل کرواکے فوری عام انتخابات منعقد کروانے کی خواہاں ہیں۔

یہ بھی خبریں زیر گردش ہیں کہ بلاول بھٹو نے مطالبہ کیا کہ میرے لانگ مارچ کے اختتام تک تحریک عدم اعتماد پیش نہ کی جائے۔ واضح رہے کپ پیپلز پارٹی کے مطابق بلاول کا لانگ مارچ 8 مارچ کو اسلام آباد میں اختتام پذیر ہو گا۔

ملاقات کے دوران آصف زرداری نے شہباز شریف سے مکالمہ کرتے ہوئے کہا کوئی کچھ بھی کہے ہمارے وزیراعظم کے امیدوار آپ ہیں۔ اپوزیشن جماعتوں نے وزیراعظم کے خلاف تحریک عدم اعتماد لانے کا ٹاسک آصف علی زرداری کے سپرد کر دیا ہے۔

مشاورت کے دوران پیپلزپارٹی نے سب سے پہلے قومی اسمبلی کے اسپیکرکے خلاف عدم اعتماد کی تحریک جمع کروانے کی تجویز دی ہے اور موقف اپنایا ہے کہ اسپیکر کے خلاف تحریک کے نتائج سے صورتحال واضح ہوجائے گی۔

رپورٹ میں ذرائع کا حوالہ دے کر بتایا گیا ہے کہ آئندہ چند روز میں اسپیکر قومی اسمبلی کے خلاف تحریک عدم اعتماد جمع کروانے کا امکان ہے۔

واضح رہے کہ گزشتہ روز مسلم لیگ ن ، پیپلزپارٹی کی قیادت اور جمیعت علمائے اسلام کے رہنماؤں کی ایک بیٹھک ہوئی تھی جس میں مختلف امور پر تبادلہ خیال کیا گیا تاہم یہ ملاقات بے نتیجہ ثابت ہوئی۔

دوسری جانب کچھ میڈیا ہاؤسز کی جانب سے دعویٰ کیا جا رہا ہے کہ اپوزیشن کے درمیان وزیراعظم کے خلاف تحریک عدم اعتماد لانے پر اتفاق ہو چکا ہے۔

ہاہاہا...یہ سب زرداری کی زبانی جمع تفریق ہے ….جب کسی کو وزیراعظم بنانے کا وقت ہوگا
شہباز شریف جیل میں ہوگا…. ?

 

[Awan S]

AAZB=Asif Ali Zardari Bhutto.
How do u define Capability? Can u share few things which were improved under AAZB and Nawaz Shareef? Can u give me name of one project built by ur leaders and are not running on Subsidy? Let me subsidy: If government is buy something at higher price and selling it a low the difference is called subsidy.

I will talk about PML(N) era only:
Got inflation at 12% in 2013 and brought to 3.9% in 2018
GDP was about 3% raised it 5.7%
Stock market was bad and reached to 53,000 all time great level in PML(N) era(it is still below that level now)
Job level was improved as government spend a lot
There were 18 hours of load shedding and brought it to almost zero.(helped improved jobs & business too)
There were one minimum one bomb blast every week which came down to zero. (Law & Order improvement helped economy too)
(Remember PPP got same problem but unable to solve that although they used army too)
CPEC is a future hope with 45 Million dollars international investment
In term of projects:
11,000 mega watt power projects including about 3500 MV hydropower
Two metro and one orange line
Thousands of kilometer motorways
CPEC route was more than 60% complete (check record)
List of hospital list is long in Punjab (two new mega hospitals in Lahore, one each in Multan & Pindi, there is long list of smaller hospitals in smaller cities)
The list of Universities is less but not that bad.
There are lot of failures too but above one are success strories.

 

[Siberite]

There are two things you have raised.

First in term of no confidence, they have two things as well. One that establishment look neutral although they may not be. Secondly they want to show attractions to government people that join us and we can offer you ticket as well as ministry. There is not much time left in either case. Government people know very well that they have no chance of winning elections in future to win elections on PTI ticket. If they miss train this time, they may not get PML(N) ticket later which will be too demanding later.

Your second question, what opposition will do different? PML(N) is an experienced party; they can ensure good governance. There is lot of important law making pending due to Khan's stub born behavior not to sit with opposition leader. Experienced party may do efforts to reduce inflation to some kind. Remember PML(N) got inflation over 12% and they bring that back to 4% gradually. PML(N) has much better relationship with China & Saudia to gain some help in terms of loans.

Mr. Awan . We need something substantial rather than cosmetic change . People have tried PMLN for many years . They also finished trying PPP and they already have seen the result of the change they were hoping will make this country and their lives better.

None of these morons are able to fulfill their promises of making people's life better.
People have bitter experience from Politicians. What we have seen in last 4 years is a disgrace of the politicians , their behavior and their attitude , either from the Government side or from the opposition side.

These moral fakes are puppets sitting on higher positions , holding Senate seats or NA seats. They are downright filth laden and totally corrupt to the core. There is no second opinion about them .
How would you call them the representatives of the nation when they are open for manipulation , run for money and dying for Boots worship. Its a disgrace to call them representatives . It is because of them , the Boot sarkar was able to screw this nation for so long and get away with it scot free. Not one of these filthy livings has any values, their jelly filled spine tells us that we have thieves every where and have no moral dignity coming from anyone of them .

I joke a lot on this site and make fun of the ruling party. They are absolutely clueless what to do and they do deserve this criticism. However, the story on the opposite side is not rosy as well . There are lines of selfish , greedy bustards ready to be sold any minute .
I quit debating any standards for these leeches. The people of this country are most unfortunate in the world. They have been made fool many times, ripped off with their dignity and their respect , not only by Politicians, not only by boots but also from the corrupt Judiciary and the Bureaucracy .

Trying to find a hope of any betterment from this group of wolfs is just straight stupidity.

 

[surfer]

Mr. Awan . We need something substantial rather than cosmetic change . People have tried PMLN for many years . They also finished trying PPP and they already have seen the result of the change they were hoping will make this country and their lives better.

None of these morons are able to fulfill their promises of making people's life better.
People have bitter experience from Politicians. What we have seen in last 4 years is a disgrace of the politicians , their behavior and their attitude , either from the Government side or from the opposition side.

These moral fakes are puppets sitting on higher positions , holding Senate seats or NA seats. They are downright filth laden and totally corrupt to the core. There is no second opinion about them .
How would you call them the representatives of the nation when they are open for manipulation , run for money and dying for Boots worship. Its a disgrace to call them representatives . It is because of them , the Boot sarkar was able to screw this nation for so long and get away with it scot free. Not one of these filthy livings has any values, their jelly filled spine tells us that we have thieves every where and have no moral dignity coming from anyone of them .

I joke a lot on this site and make fun of the ruling party. They are absolutely clueless what to do and they do deserve this criticism. However, the story on the opposite side is not rosy as well . There are lines of selfish , greedy bustards ready to be sold any minute .
I quit debating any standards for these leeches. The people of this country are most unfortunate in the world. They have been made fool many times, ripped off with their dignity and their respect , not only by Politicians, not only by boots but also from the corrupt Judiciary and the Bureaucracy .

Trying to find a hope of any betterment from this group of wolfs is just straight stupidity.

Interesting, so what's the solution? (Thats the 64 million dollar question I guess) ?

 

[Hate_Nooras]

This is true that whenever someone is government opposition try to topple government with the help of establishment. Khan has done the same, first he conducted Dharna 1 with the help of ISI chief Zaheer Aslam and second one without the help of anyone. Nothing worked and then establishment jumped in with with power to disqualify Nawaz through Aqama. Opposition is trying since day-1 but establishment was not helping them. This time around, they think establishment is at least neutral if not with them or Khan. What goes around comes back. Khan is hearing similar music now what he played in past.

NS wasn't disqualified for just the Aqama, he lied to the SC. Why is he living in the very flats you guys and him have always claimed weren't his.
As far as the establishment is concerned, you and you reps tell us IK has pissed them off and they want him out. Are you now saying that you were lying? I am really confused with your lies

 

[Hate_Nooras]

Mr. Awan . We need something substantial rather than cosmetic change . People have tried PMLN for many years . They also finished trying PPP and they already have seen the result of the change they were hoping will make this country and their lives better.

None of these morons are able to fulfill their promises of making people's life better.
People have bitter experience from Politicians. What we have seen in last 4 years is a disgrace of the politicians , their behavior and their attitude , either from the Government side or from the opposition side.

These moral fakes are puppets sitting on higher positions , holding Senate seats or NA seats. They are downright filth laden and totally corrupt to the core. There is no second opinion about them .
How would you call them the representatives of the nation when they are open for manipulation , run for money and dying for Boots worship. Its a disgrace to call them representatives . It is because of them , the Boot sarkar was able to screw this nation for so long and get away with it scot free. Not one of these filthy livings has any values, their jelly filled spine tells us that we have thieves every where and have no moral dignity coming from anyone of them .

I joke a lot on this site and make fun of the ruling party. They are absolutely clueless what to do and they do deserve this criticism. However, the story on the opposite side is not rosy as well . There are lines of selfish , greedy bustards ready to be sold any minute .
I quit debating any standards for these leeches. The people of this country are most unfortunate in the world. They have been made fool many times, ripped off with their dignity and their respect , not only by Politicians, not only by boots but also from the corrupt Judiciary and the Bureaucracy .

Trying to find a hope of any betterment from this group of wolfs is just straight stupidity.

Interesting points made.

 

[Siberite]

Interesting, so what's the solution? (Thats the 64 million dollar question I guess) ?

قلزم ھستی سے توُ ابھرا ہے مانند حباب
اس زیاں خانے میں تیرا امتحاں ہے زندگی​

 

[Tit4Tat]

Mr. Awan . We need something substantial rather than cosmetic change . People have tried PMLN for many years . They also finished trying PPP and they already have seen the result of the change they were hoping will make this country and their lives better.

None of these morons are able to fulfill their promises of making people's life better.
People have bitter experience from Politicians. What we have seen in last 4 years is a disgrace of the politicians , their behavior and their attitude , either from the Government side or from the opposition side.

These moral fakes are puppets sitting on higher positions , holding Senate seats or NA seats. They are downright filth laden and totally corrupt to the core. There is no second opinion about them .
How would you call them the representatives of the nation when they are open for manipulation , run for money and dying for Boots worship. Its a disgrace to call them representatives . It is because of them , the Boot sarkar was able to screw this nation for so long and get away with it scot free. Not one of these filthy livings has any values, their jelly filled spine tells us that we have thieves every where and have no moral dignity coming from anyone of them .

I joke a lot on this site and make fun of the ruling party. They are absolutely clueless what to do and they do deserve this criticism. However, the story on the opposite side is not rosy as well . There are lines of selfish , greedy bustards ready to be sold any minute .
I quit debating any standards for these leeches. The people of this country are most unfortunate in the world. They have been made fool many times, ripped off with their dignity and their respect , not only by Politicians, not only by boots but also from the corrupt Judiciary and the Bureaucracy .

Trying to find a hope of any betterment from this group of wolfs is just straight stupidity.

good points, and it is true, we have been unlucky, not a single worthy leader since losing Baba e Qaum so early.

 

[Cape Kahloon]

Lo g yeh tu confirmed hu geya Udam itmad 100% nakam hu ge keyoon kay Zardari itna bewaqoof ne ha jo Shabaz ko PM banay ga oor khud opposition main bhetay ga.

 

[Okara]

I will talk about PML(N) era only:
Got inflation at 12% in 2013 and brought to 3.9% in 2018

https://www.statista.com/statistics/383760/inflation-rate-in-pakistan/
If inflation is the criteria then PMLQ under Musharraf was way better than PMLN.

GDP was about 3% raised it 5.7%

https://www.statista.com/statistics/383739/gross-domestic-product-gdp-in-pakistan/
Please check the historical trend and see who was ruling during 90% where no gain over couple of years?

Stock market was bad and reached to 53,000 all time great level in PML(N) era(it is still below that level now)

For me stock market is nothing more than a gambling place so will not discuss it.

Job level was improved as government spend a lot

https://www.statista.com/statistics/383735/unemployment-rate-in-pakistan/
Don't u think PMLQ under Musharraf was performing great? Also 2019-22 is the covid period and the trends are same all over the world.

There were 18 hours of load shedding and brought it to almost zero.(helped improved jobs & business too)

Total Installed capacity in Pakistan was 37K MWe and Transmission Capacity left by PMLN was 23K MWe. Peak consumption in Summer is 27MWe and 16MWe in winter.
Please enlighten us how to avoid circular debt especially based on the contracts signed by PMLN/PPP/Musharraf?

There were one minimum one bomb blast every week which came down to zero. (Law & Order improvement helped economy too)
(Remember PPP got same problem but unable to solve that although they used army too)

What was US claim in Drone attacks in Pakistan? BTW how many drone attacks during the present government?

CPEC is a future hope with 45 Million dollars international investment

https://tradingeconomics.com/pakistan/foreign-direct-investment
Please check and see in which era FDI was more in Pakistan from 2000-2022?

In term of projects:
11,000 mega watt power projects including about 3500 MV hydropower

Already explained and want ur help to minimize circular debt based on PMLN/PPP/Musharraf contracts.

Two metro and one orange line
Thousands of kilometer motorways

Orange Train/ Metros built by PMLN requires huge subsidy. Orange Train is not covering even Power Bill through fare and Punjab's 85% transport Budget is used to subsidized Orange Train alone.
Keep in mind Metros were operated by Turkish Companies means Pakistan was the only country from whole world where a Public service was provided on Subsidy through Private company and above all a foreign company. Same for Lahore cleaning through Turkish company.
Please compare construction cost of Motorways built by PMLN vs PTI

CPEC route was more than 60% complete (check record)
List of hospital list is long in Punjab (two new mega hospitals in Lahore, one each in Multan & Pindi, there is long list of smaller hospitals in smaller cities)

Please share list of Hospitals built by PMLN and named one where Shareefs can be treated?

The list of Universities is less but not that bad.

Universities announced vs built by Nawaz Shareef? BTW which university was built by PMLN?

There are lot of failures too but above one are success strories.

I completely agree with you. PMLN has just stories but no data to support their claims.

 

[surfer]

قلزم ھستی سے توُ ابھرا ہے مانند حباب
اس زیاں خانے میں تیرا امتحاں ہے زندگی​

very poetic,...but if you dont mind me saying so, doesn't move the debate forward...
Don't get me wrong, I don't have a magic wand either ?

But there has to be a way forward...late now, perhaps we can continue the debate some other day.....

 

[Awan S]

Mr. Awan . We need something substantial rather than cosmetic change . People have tried PMLN for many years . They also finished trying PPP and they already have seen the result of the change they were hoping will make this country and their lives better.

None of these morons are able to fulfill their promises of making people's life better.
People have bitter experience from Politicians. What we have seen in last 4 years is a disgrace of the politicians , their behavior and their attitude , either from the Government side or from the opposition side.

These moral fakes are puppets sitting on higher positions , holding Senate seats or NA seats. They are downright filth laden and totally corrupt to the core. There is no second opinion about them .
How would you call them the representatives of the nation when they are open for manipulation , run for money and dying for Boots worship. Its a disgrace to call them representatives . It is because of them , the Boot sarkar was able to screw this nation for so long and get away with it scot free. Not one of these filthy livings has any values, their jelly filled spine tells us that we have thieves every where and have no moral dignity coming from anyone of them .

I joke a lot on this site and make fun of the ruling party. They are absolutely clueless what to do and they do deserve this criticism. However, the story on the opposite side is not rosy as well . There are lines of selfish , greedy bustards ready to be sold any minute .
I quit debating any standards for these leeches. The people of this country are most unfortunate in the world. They have been made fool many times, ripped off with their dignity and their respect , not only by Politicians, not only by boots but also from the corrupt Judiciary and the Bureaucracy .

Trying to find a hope of any betterment from this group of wolfs is just straight stupidity.

What PTI has done substantial:
They got Inflation 3.9% and took it between 12-20%
They got corruption rating 117 and took it 141
They got better job position than what it is
They caused big governance issues like flour, sugar, fertilizers, rise in Dangi
They ruined PIA & Pakistani pilot by fake pilot case
They doubled the institutions deficits
They increased foreign loans much more than any other government
They took that many loans internally that IMF have to ban them taking further loans from State Bank
In addition to above, they have not done any projects where you can see that big amounts were spent.
PML(N) is not the best but proved that at least they are better than PTI & PPP.
If corruption increased substationally than how you can prove that current government is honest?
If everyone knows that boots helped them to come into power; how you can prove that Khan party is not

 

[Siberite]

very poetic,...but if you dont mind me saying so, doesn't move the debate forward...
Don't get me wrong, I don't have a magic wand either ?

But there has to be a way forward...late now, perhaps we can continue the debate some other day.....

Even if we can come forward with some plan for the future, its just between us and doesn't have potential to be adopted by the nation . We can talk all we want here, exchange ideas and present plans , Unless ,otherwise the nation rise above their patty differences, and realize their potential, no earth will move , no change will be made.

 

[Siberite]

What PTI has done substantial:
They got Inflation 3.9% and took it between 12-20%
They got corruption rating 117 and took it 141
They got better job position than what it is
They caused big governance issues like flour, sugar, fertilizers, rise in Dangi
They ruined PIA & Pakistani pilot by fake pilot case
They doubled the institutions deficits
They increased foreign loans much more than any other government
They took that many loans internally that IMF have to ban them taking further loans from State Bank
In addition to above, they have not done any projects where you can see that big amounts were spent.
PML(N) is not the best but proved that at least they are better than PTI & PPP.
If corruption increased substationally than how you can prove that current government is honest?
If everyone knows that boots helped them to come into power; how you can prove that Khan party is not

Where did I say they are free of impairments ?
My concern is that you are too optimistic and think that PMLN will turn the tie around . I think it is farce ... Continue to try the same method and expecting a different result is insanity . What PMLN and its leadership has done in last 4 years is also pretty shameful, to say the least .
Just in the matter of extending the COAS term itself speaks volumes about their mentality and their steadfastness. They are not trustworthy on their words and deeds.

 

[surfer]

Even if we can come forward with some plan for the future, its just between us and doesn't have potential to be adopted by the nation . We can talk all we want here, exchange ideas and present plans , Unless ,otherwise the nation rise above their patty differences, and realize their potential, no earth will move , no change will be made.

You’re right, it will be purely academic, almost not worth doing in other words…?

 

[LeanMean2]

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